Tween angry about electronics limits because friends don't have them

Try to keep her busy with other things (hiking, swimming, soccer, dance, music, chess, etc) either as a family activity, in a class, or with a group of friends, then she won't have enough spare time to need limits. Really this strategy is working well for me and my child.

Hi there -

I would advise you to stick to your guns. And take "no else has screen limits" with a grain of salt. That is the rallying cry of tweens and teens and a little investigation often uncovers a more nuanced truth. My response has been something along the lines of "our rules are different," and, in an attempt at levity "looks like you landed in the wrong family." The smart phone thing is harder, and gets more complicated every year it seems. Our son, now 14, didn't get a smart phone until 8th grade. Our daughter, now 20, inherited a used one in 9th grade from a friend because we wouldn't buy her one. But more and more it seems "everyone" has one. We don't allow any screens in my son's bedroom, so there are ways to limit access once they have them. But it is difficult and tiring to be always monitoring. And as for the anger - it comes with the territory. Good luck.

I feel your pain. I will say that kids can make it out like you're the only one who sets limits, when in fact if you talk with other parents they are setting limits too. Perhaps taking your daughter to a screening of the movie Screenagers may be helpful. I also feel that, as parents, we have to pick our poison, as while it's really difficult to set limits, this board is full of parents talking about how their tech-obsessed preteens and teens ignore family and school, or truly show signs of addiction. I can say that both personally and professionally I talk with many, many parents of teens who wish they were in your position and tell me they wished they would have set limits before things got out of control. While some may argue that setting limits causes a "forbidden fruit" effect, the truth is that setting early limits, e.g., as we do with junk food, leads to less unhealthy use later on.

Richard Freed, Ph.D., father of 9- and 13-year-old girls and the author of Wired Child: Reclaiming Childhood in a Digital Age.

Make sure she is not playing you. Kids are famous for saying that "nobody else has to _____" (get off the phone, do their homework, eat their vegetables, do their chores, etc." I would check in with a few other parents and see what info you can get. Beyond that, it doesn't really matter what other kids' parents are doing, you are in charge of your family. It may be helpful to frame it as "in our family, we _____" but it is sure to infuriate her. Good for you for holding off on the phone and tablet. It is a slippery slope and an exhausting battle. Once she understands that you are not going to cave, she may be less angry. 

The best thing about giving your kid a phone (though not until middle school in my opinion) is that you then have so much leverage for getting the kind of behavior you want. Kids LIVE for their phones. Therefore—if she complains about having limits, take the phone away for a few days. If she makes a big scene about that, add a few more days. It was amazing how quickly my protesting, whining child figured out how to be polite, do homework, go to bed on time, etc. Giving them phones (rather than letting them just use mine occasionally) actually made limit-setting easier. 

Do you know any of these friends' parents? Or can you find out how to contact them? Our girls would complain from time to time about the vast privileges "everyone else" had, but when I would call or e-mail, it frequently turned out that "everyone" was just three or four kids.

Just a strong vote of encouragement from here to hold your ground!  I'm not sure what your question is - to give in and get her the devices she wants, and relax the limits?  Our daughter is 11 (will turn 12 in the fall), and we just got her a first cellphone, whose internet capacity we disabled, with ample discussion with her.  Just a phone to call and text, since she's starting middle school.  It helps that 3 of her friends have the identical (limited) new phone, so there's not the "everyone has them" angle.  I let her use my iPad and laptop at home (for occasional Minecraft and watching reruns of Downton Abbey) though she knows there is a baseline 30-minute limit per day (relaxed for sick days and weekends at times), and no use on school nights.  Seems to me perhaps the conversation with your daughter might be: as long as it is had negotiating limits, she will not get her own.  And later when she gets one: if she fights the limits, it goes away for a while.  Maybe also try watching the Screenagers movie with her - it was an important and sobering movie for our family - see screenagersmovie.com for screenings coming up, as well as helpful links and info (looks like there are a few not too far away, in September).  Our 11 year old said after seeing it, "I don't think I want a smartphone yet - I don't want to get addicted".  

I just wanted to respond to say that you are not alone as a parent setting limits on these things. I have 2 kids, both boys, a 12 yr. old going into 7th grade, and a 9 yr. old going into 4th. The older one did not get a phone until he went to middle school, and even then, it was with lots of restrictions, rules and limitations. Any app that has in its terms of service that you have to be 13 yrs. old to use it, he doesn't get. That means pretty much every social app out there. It often seems like we are the only family that has held firm on that, but I can't justify him lying about his age to use these apps. There are good reasons that kids should not be on social media apps until they are at least 13. 

We have no plans to get a phone for the younger kid until he gets to middle school, and I imagine we will hold to the same limitations there. My kids have a kindle, but without internet browsing, and only with games that I approve (I also use Common Sense Media as a general guide). They have no access to a computer in my house except when I sign them onto my laptop and they use it in the common area. 

All this is just to say that I'm with you. My kids complain and say that we are the only parents in the world who have such restrictions. So I just wanted you to know that you weren't alone. Sorry I don't have good advice for how to make it easier, though! Good luck!

My son is 15. Most of his friends did not get a phone until middle school. I'm not sure why 10 year olds need a phone unless they have a long walk home from school or go off on their own frequently or something like that. Most of my son's friends also had limits on gaming at that age. Some of his friends had no gaming at all until middle school when peer pressure set in fiercely and parents capitulated. I thought the "no gaming" was too strict, but I did set limits on screen time and still do now that he is in high school. iPads are nice for kids, really great for road trips and boring visits with adult friends and relatives. Maybe next birthday or Christmas? Just establish some sensible rules and have a place not in her room where all electronics charge at night. 

My son is now 16.  We had a similar situation.  At your daughter's age, we had a DS that he and his younger sister shared during travel, a Wii, and a family computer (not used for gaming).  We gave him a simple call/text phone at age 12 when he began flying to his grandmother's house by himself.  The same year, he and his sister received iPads primarily to be used for family travel and as an e-reader at home.  At 14, in 8th grade, we gave him my old iPhone with the understanding that it would be used for communication and school related uses. We allowed a few games.  He saved gift money and bought himself an X-box. 

Throughout it all, we had strict parental controls enabled on all devices.  Mobile devices were checked in at night.  Throughout it all, we were very clear in our family values around electronics.  We empathized that it's hard and doesn't seem fair when other families are much more relaxed.  We also listened to him and adjusted when reasonable to us.  We did not try to control what happened with electronics at his friends' houses.  A handful of times, he felt uncomfortable with what was going on at others houses and came home.

He complained, threw tantrums, pushed back very hard, yet we held firm, slowly granting greater access as appropriate for his development.  He recently purchased a brand new iPhone for himself.  We have no controls on it.  We do set limits on the WiFi and cell service is such that he does not have access on school nights when he should be sleeping.

The last year or two, kids he knows have gotten into very challenging situations enabled by their use of electronics.  He's old enough now to see kids really screwing up in many ways, digital and otherwise.  A week or so ago he came to me and said he was 90% grateful with the way we've raised him. 

Do what feels reasonable to you and supports your family values.  Communicate it to your daughter and be empathetic when it doesn't feel fair to her.  Be willing to listen, evaluate, and adjust.  It's not a negotiation.  You are the parent.  Oh, yes, also check out http://www.screenagersmovie.com/.  And, of course, set a good example yourself around use of electronics.

Good luck.

"All families are different and what might work or be ok in some families is different from ours" is the response in our family to complaints about things allowed by friends.   Just a few other comments/thoughts...

-  I don't think getting her a smart phone is going to help with enforcing limits.

- does her friend actually not have limits or is that just the perception.  She might think something that's not actually true.

- are the limits you are setting reasonable and realistic?  Yes, there are guidelines, but so they make sense?  Is her social development being limited (by not being in contact with friends at certain times)?  

My son is a little older than your child, but what's mostly worked for us is to include him in setting the limits and having conversations about why limits are important to our family and the negative impact too much screen time can have. Ask questions like, "How much time do you think is appropriate to be on a screen?" Use that as a starting place to work together to come up with a media plan. Sure, setting limits is important, and ultimately you are the parent, but you can take away some of the power struggle by including her in deciding on how much time she can be on screens. It's a lot easier to say, "You need to get off your phone now - you've been on it for X amount of time. Remember you agreed that X amount of time was more than enough," than it is to say, "Get off because I say so." I will also add that by including your daughter in deciding the limits, you are helping her learn self control and moderation. The goal is for her to have access to technology, but also for her to be able to manage it in a healthy way as she gets more independent. My strategy has always been to talk with my son. We talk about Snap Chat and Instagram. We talk about what his friends are doing online. We talk about the positive sides of social media, as well as the negatives. I try and help him make connections between behavior and outcomes. Talking, and listening, have always worked better than any of my parenting strategies. And, it's important to remember that our kids are individuals with wants and desires that may be different than ours. I felt similarly to you - I had no interest in getting my son a cell phone (not even a smart phone, but any cell phone). With that said, our roles as parents isn't to mold our kids into what we want them to be, it's to help them discover who they are and give them the tools to be the best person possible. Your daughter may want access to technology. Just because you don't value it as part of her life, doesn't mean she feels the same way. The more you show her the things that matter to her aren't important to you, the less likely she will be to open up to you. And, from my experiences with teens, they find ways to do what they enjoy, even if it means sneaking around or lying. So my advice is to include her in coming up with a plan and keep the lines of communication open. Good luck!

Kindle or Google has settings to set limits on site usage and time. Norton has a software program for family also to review usage or set limits? 

I would have her sign a written contract and set terms in it for use? 

But aware that electronics is used by other family members, like me for work, I try to let my tween know when I am using my electronics for work vs pleasure. 

It is harder to re negotiate after a habit starts then setting limits s at the beginning and I get requests to renegotiate each year

i have recently started planning time and activities that can replace e time and that works well. 

Good luck

Realistically, I'm sorry to say that I don't think you can keep these things away from her. She needs a smart phone because it's like any person now having ANY phone. In the beginning I attempted to keep my daughter from having one. I eventually got her an iPhone and now that she's a young teenager I wouldn't dream of taking it away from her. Set limits, I fully agree. (Or try to, FWIW.) But really, even my five-year-old nephew has a smart phone. Sorry for the news...

I feel your pain!  I have teenagers and I wished I had put more time limits and access controls in place earlier in their lives so that it wouldn't be like I was now taking something away.  We had loosely said "no more than 1 hour a day on school days, and 2 hours on weekends", but the constant reminders wore us down and was very hard to enforce, especially after letting it slip on many occasions.   Thankfully there some helpful technologies that have come out.  If this had been part of the rules from the beginning they wouldn't have questioned it as much.  It is not easy, but I believe it is necessary and best to do it in a way that you don't have to actually enforce constantly, but instead have it set up to be controlled remotely.  Some options for internet controls are to get a wifi router on which you can set up several accounts, give her a separate account and put in a shut off time.  One device that I recently got that is very easy to use is called "Circle by Disney".  You can buy it at Best Buy and they have exceptional customer service.  The device connects to the wifi and you can set up profiles for each person and device, and then set up daily time limits, bedtimes, and restrict assess based on maturity.  It has a feature that allows you to pause the wifi anytime you want.  It also has a history feature so you can monitor which websites your kids are visiting and if they tried to access something that was blocked based on the maturity setting you have selected.  My kids got computers at pretty young ages, and phones due to taking the train to school.  We got smart phones because they were easy to use, but I wish I had turned off access to data so would not have access to internet browsing, social media or other when they were using their phones.  At least with the iPhone you can use the restrictions feature to lock down the access (takes a little figuring out on the iPhone).  And with ATT you can also sign up for Smart Limits (for a fee) and to restrict access to cellular data during certain hours.  So between putting remote access limits on at home for the wifi, restrictions on the phone to block Safari and downloading, and then Smart Limits on the data, it will help a lot.  I wish it wasn't like this in our modern age, but what else can we do?

I have a 13 y/o daughter who seems pretty obsessed with her phone. I am looking into getting CIrcle with Disney, which is supposed to remotely set limits on screen time and which websites/apps she can access to at various times and days fo the week. it's not perfect, but it takes the limits a bit out of your hands and can limit the fighting, I think. You can check it out on Amazon in the discussions area.