Kids' Friendships & Socializing

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  • Nine year old-Not making friends.

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    Jan 10, 2024

    I have a 9 yr old boy, in the fourth grade, private school who has ADHD-inattentive features. This year has been very rough. Kids in his class exclude him from activities, he gets picked last for teams and does not have any friends. The few friends he had in past don't want to play with him. When I ask why he doesn't have friends he says he doesn't know why or brings up something that happened in the third grade. I've observed on the playground during yard duty that he eats alone and does not play with other kids. The exclusion and isolation seem to have gotten worse prior to Christmas break. When I dropped him off during recess (January 2024) he didn't want to get out of the car and play with the other kids. He dropped his bag off at the office, walked outside and put his head down and walked to the stadium stairs. This is so heartbreaking. I feel awful. I have some appointments lined up at Kaiser but not terribly hopeful. 

    I don't understand why he is being excluded. I asked one of the kids mom if he did something to make her son not like him. She said that once he got overly upset about something minor and it scared him. I spoke with his teacher and principal and they are going to observe. I've put him in sports but he seems not to like that either. He likes swimming and roller skating.  Again, I feel awful any suggestions or guidance would help. Please no shameful or mean comments. 

    TIA, 

    C

    Jan 10, 2024

    I'm sorry, this sounds bad. I am a little concerned about the quality of the school environment if the teacher was not aware of this prior to your raising it. My main thought is to keep pursuing social activities outside of school, and look into a change of school as a fresh start for next year. He may be in such a small school that the pool of potential friends is very small, and one misstep follows you for life. In the meantime, be his friend - that is, you or his dad make a point of doing something fun, playing to his interests/strengths, every weekend so he keeps a spark of joy alive.

    Jan 13, 2024

    I'm so sorry your son is going through this. My son (also ADHD) started having this same experience in fourth grade and it got much worse in fifth. Nobody was bullying him—they all just ignored him and left him out. I think ADHD made it very difficult for him to read social cues which caused the other kids to find him off-putting and strange. My son never understood why he was being left out and it took him all the way until his junior year of high school before he started to make some friends. He's still not great at it but better enough that he has a group to hang out with now and has enough confidence and resiliency to keep working at social skills.

    We got through the very difficult late-elementary and middle school years by not pushing him to eat with the other kids or play games with them at recess (because that just made him feel worse). He spent those years eating lunch in the library and spending recess in the classroom helping the teachers out with things. Not ideal of course, but better than sitting alone and miserable on a playground bench.

    Hang in there. He will most likely figure things out a bit as he gets older.

    Jan 15, 2024

    Oh mama, I'm so sorry - I understand how sad this feels. And to think you are paying private school tuition on top of it all! Agree that it is surprising the school is not more observant/involved. If it were my kid, I'd change schools at the end of this school year. 4th/5th grade is no joke, kids are not 'little' any more and stuff that happens now starts to really shape them up to and through middle school. I also echo that finding a tribe for him will really help. If he likes swimming how about getting him on a swim team? Or if it's roller skating is there a group he can join? Having a separate place (other than school) where he feels happy and welcome is really key in a situation like this - scouting, volunteer groups, anything that is other than school where he can feel he fits will make a huge difference, but again, I'd look for a new school environment. Good luck to you!!

    Jan 15, 2024

    I'm so sorry to hear. It is so heartbreaking to see your child have trouble at school and with friendship. I strongly recommend that you consider switching schools. When you mentioned that he is picked last for sports, I immediately thought this isn't a school culture that is inclusive. Our child goes to a small progressive private school in Oakland, and PE and sports are cooperative rather than competitive. They don't do team member picking, and everyone goes out of their way to be inclusive. In fact, if kids try to exclude a kid from their activities, teachers would jump in and address that immediately. The school culture is very important for kids that need social support.

    Teachers and administrators should be working hard to work with you and your child, if there's a social issue like this. Many kids change school in 4th and 5th grades, so don't worry about joining schools in the upper grades.

    In terms of sports, if he likes swimming, how about a swim team? Swimming is incredibly calming and therapeutic. Does he like to sing, act, or arts? Singing is also very helpful for ADHD and anxiety. Pacific Boy Choir Academy has after school programs, and it's a very supportive environment. Our child does the after school choir program there and have made sweet friends. 

    Jan 15, 2024

    Consider switching him to a public school. There will be more tolerance, less cliquishness, and more different kids he might fit in with. And I think the teachers and staff will be more aware of these dynamics. A public school will also have to accommodate his ADHD and may have more resources for this than a small private school. Also, swimming and roller skating are great activities, look for a team or group activity outside of school like swim team, synchronized swimming, water hockey, water polo... In terms of Kaiser, they may have a social skills group for his age.

    Jan 15, 2024

    I am a retired public elementary school teacher.  We had school wide programs to help students develop social skills and resolve disagreements with peers. A child with a physical disability or a child who was socially isolated would be paired up with a "buddy" to support them at recess.  In the classroom, small groups worked together in science projects and in other subject areas, so students interacted with each other developing social and cooperative work skills.  You are right to be proactive about your son's situation, which is so damaging to his self-concept.  In public schools, a parent may request in writing a Student Study Team meeting which includes the principal, learning resource specialists, classroom teacher and parent to discuss student problems, both academic and emotional.  I hope your son's private school has a process like this in place. In public schools, the clock starts with the submission of the request, the meeting must occur within a certain time frame.  Public school resource teachers also serve private school students.

    This article may be helpful: https://www.verywellhealth.com/is-adhd-a-disability-adhd-accommodations…;

    Jan 15, 2024

    This sounds exactly like what I went through - just a couple of years later than he is. At this age crowd-mentality and cliquiness sets in. Boys won't play with someone who could harm their social status. In my case as well, I had some ADHD-inattentive features and I did get overly upset about minor things. I feel in hindsight that the issue was that I was a highly-sensitive-person. Toxic masculine traits that some of the other boys displayed affected me and that made me the target of bullying first and ostracisation later. On the occasions that I did try being toxic to "fit in" it didn't work and just marked me as a weirdo. I would recommend therapy. Being able to tell the difference between what might have been meant as a joke and what was genuinely hurtful is something I learnt in high school and also figuring a measured response to something that was genuinely hurtful will certainly help. I think the best way here is for your son to figure it out with his friends on his own without the parents getting overly involved. In my case my mom did get involved (at my request I might add) and it did not end well for me. It's important that your son realizes that his feelings are valid. He has every right to feel bad about something someone said to him. What he could work on might be better coping strategies when those feelings come up. Hang in there - it gets better as boys grow older, especially nowadays with so much information out there about bullying and toxicity.

    Jan 16, 2024

    My son with ADHD had a similarly hard time making friends in elementary school.

    Some things we did:

    -Joined Cub Scouts which was a great way for him to see the same kids doing a variety of activities several times/month until 5th grade. 

    - I made 1:1 play dates for him with the most accepting, tolerant and kind kid in his class.  Unfortunately, this particular kid was understandably very popular so to get a toe in the door I schmoozed his Mom at every school-related event that I saw her in and before and after playdates so that she would have a harder time saying "no" if I called to ask her for a playdate.  She has since become a dear friend.  And that kid and my son, now in college, are STILL great friends

    - Before one of these 1:1 playdates I would sit with my kid and do some role-playing about sharing, taking turns, and managing emotions.  It seemed to help during the actual playdate. 

    - Once my ADHD kid started taking medication in 4th grade, the medications tamped down his hyperactivity which was off-putting to peers and his relationships with other kids got much better. 

    - AND I would second the prior poster in questioning what kind of oversight the Administration is providing at the school your son is in and considering transferring next year. 

    Jan 17, 2024

    My daughter (now 18) has inattentive-type ADHD.  After nearly flunking 1st grade, she went on stimulant medication at the beginning of 2nd grade.  The meds were a godsend, not just academically but socially.  As her doctor said, it's not just about school, but also life.  She doesn't like the meds (nor do other kids we know), and doesn't take them on weekends or vacations, but she is profoundly grateful for them.

    Reason: inattentive kids do seem weird because they are off in their own worlds and can't get back to the "real" one.  My daughter says she'd get caught up studying a bit of dust on the floor or daydreaming ("watching movies in my head"), totally unaware of what was going on around her.  I witnessed this at home.  On the playground, if she was talking to another kid, she might stop talking abruptly because her attention got caught by an idea or an object, such that the other person simply disappeared for her.  I can't imagine what a hell most sports would be for your son, spacing out after a few moments of no action, then of course never catching that ball and the rest of the team hating him for it.

    (What my kid experiences is pretty well described here: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/object-permanence-adhd.) 

    She got in trouble a lot with teachers for inattention and impulsive behaviors.  This led her to avoid social contacts that might lead to trouble, such as talking in class.  The meds allowed her to pay attention to her environment, including other people, and monitor her own behavior.  My daughter just leaned over my shoulder to read this, and adds that the meds also help her be motivated for tasks like homework.

    I'm writing this because your post doesn't mention any treatment.  I know a lot of parents are reluctant to medicate their kids.  A common worry is that prescribed medication may lead to a drug problem later.  The evidence indicates, however, that failing to treat ADHD is more likely to lead to substance abuse, because the person with ADHD may seek relief through self-medication (eg., https://www.healthline.com/health/mental-health/adhd-and-addiction). We also have Kaiser, and didn't have any trouble getting once our daughter was diagnosed.  If you're uncomfortable with stimulants, there are nonstimulant medications, and if you're prepared for what's involved, behavioral-modification treatment.  The research indicates that stimulant medication is the most effective stand-alone treatment.

    I agree with the replies suggesting that you change schools.  Obviously the one you're in isn't helping much, and private schools have no obligation to do so, though some are better than others.  Our daughter was in private school until 9th grade, and the school did OK regarding ADHD (specifically, she got accommodations and was never bullied).  She says, based on her experiences at Berkeley High, that the Berkeley public schools would probably do as well or better.  Maybe more important, changing schools would allow your son to escape the fixed opinions that seem to have formed at his current school.

    Jan 22, 2024

    I just want to chime in to ask if your school has a counselor for ADHD kids or a special teacher who can assist with resources.  In contrast, our school reached out to me and provided assistance and it made a great difference.  We had someone who would address the inattentiveness and ladder cues to turn in paperwork.  Eventually, the timers and post-its and the whiteboard reminders at home worked.  It is a process and it is hard to watch.  We had a great struggle until his executive functioning started to kick in and then, it was not perfect but better.  If you would like to talk, you can ask the moderator for my email.  Hang in there.

    Jan 25, 2024

  • Introverted 4th grader

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    Nov 17, 2021

    Our son is a great little boy who really seems to lack social skills, especially in groups and on the playground. He engages well 1:1 with peers or his sister but it’s awkward and painful to watch him stand by himself at a birthday party while the other kids are laughing and joking and chasing each other around. They don’t bully him they just ignore him. He’s not good at sports but he’s a pretty strong artist and does fairly well in school. He just seems to be missing something. It’s kind of hard to imagine he might have ASD but I guess it’s possible. We’re going to have the speech therapist observe him. I don’t know if he can learn the social dance that others do naturally. We try to remind him to say hi and give him ideas to talk about with friends. I’m not even sure he wants to learn! He seems pretty content just observing from the sidelines.This whole thing bothers me more than it seems to bother him. I actually like the company of introverts and I don’t want to pathologize his personality but I also fear him missing out on the joys of friends and fun. He’s going to be in middle school soon and that just seems so intimidating for a loner. I don’t think we’ll be able to arrange play dates in 7th grade. Anybody else have a kid like ours? What are your experiences?

    Nov 17, 2021

    Shelly Hansen in Oakland helped our son a lot at that age.your son might also need support before going to college, social demands change rapidly then.

    Good luck!

    Nov 24, 2021

    I'm not sure how helpful this will be, but this sounds a lot like me when I was a kid. Although I did have a select few close friends as a child, I was generally very shy with other kids and would take a lot of warming up before I felt comfortable enough to jump in and play. I also sometimes just preferred to play alone. My mom used to say that when she would pick me up from daycare she would see other kids come up to try to play with me, and I would kind of just ignore them. (I still sometimes suspect I might be "on the spectrum" myself, but I've never sought or had a diagnosis.) As I got older, my shyness developed into pretty serious social anxiety. At a school dance or other kind of social event, I often hung out on the sidelines: I never knew what to say or do with my hands or body. I'm sure I would have benefited from some therapy with a compassionate and sensitive psychologist, and it seems likely your son might too.

    More to your point, I also think that my parents' anxiety about my anxiety was absolutely part of the problem. I'm not sure I would have so thoroughly pathologized my own shy- and solitariness had I not been made to feel like it was something to conquer rather than just another part of who I am. So I would urge you to tread lightly on the topic. Social anxiety and awkwardness are often not things you can just get over, and trying to "fix" them can sometimes merely heighten their discomfort.

    Finally, I just want to say that while my early junior high school years were socially excruciating, things started looking up for me by high school. Perhaps this is not true of your son, but I found that what was best for me was to have a few very core genuine friends and not to worry too much about engaging in big groups or events. As long as I had a buddy to navigate these situations with, I was fine. (And I think that if I had not been made to feel like there was something weird about hanging out alone, I would have been fine just observing by myself as well.) I have by no means missed out on friends and fun—I just tend to like them in smaller quantities than many others do.

    Nov 24, 2021

    I really appreciate your thoughtful replies 

    Dec 7, 2021

    Hi - I would encourage you to get your son a full psychological evaluation for your son including Autism spectrum.  I am responding as someone who wishes she had done this for her own son 8 years ago.  My son was always very quiet and though he did participate in sports, he sounds much like your son.  I thought I was honoring who he was -- it turns out that he has -- and likely always had -- severe social anxiety.  We are still waiting on an evaluation, but he might be very high functioning autistic.  I was never fond of labels, but I wish I had known more about my sweet guy earlier. At the very least you might be able to get him in a social skills therapy group. I wish you all the luck -- it sounds like you are doing a good job. 

    Dec 8, 2021

    I have an outgoing and generally social child. Child usually has no problem making new friends at camps, playgrounds, etc. However, I have observed that even my wonderfuly bubbly child sometimes freezes up at parties. A larger group setting is not easy. Even for adults. How many of us dread going to a party where we know one or two people and we don't know a lot of people very well. Remember the horrible networking mixers?  It's not comfortable. It makes one feel vulnerable. Sometimes my child clams up at parties and wants to stay with me instead of play with other kids. I support how the child is feeling that day. If your son has friends whose company he really enjoys and and activities that he likes doing with those friends, I would encourage and support those. His idea of fun may not be a large group activity. If he is having trouble engaging with peers at recess at school and lunch time or he cannot name one or two BFF, I'd be concerned. 

    Dec 8, 2021

  • 3rd grader with very few friends

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    Dec 12, 2020

    Seeking advice or words of wisdom in regards to my 3rd grader (8 year old). She has a strong personality- strong likes and dislikes and is very expressive about them (lots of big hugs and at other times stomping & frustration). She is an avid reader. She loves to be outdoors doing non structured activities - she can spend hours playing in the sand at the beach or collecting sticks, organizing them and making up creative stories. During recess she likes to play under a tree with dirt or mud while making up stories and games. Her writing and conversation skills are ok. When she wants to, she will ask lots of questions but isnt always keen on answering questions. Pre pandemic, I got minimal details about school. 

    My worry is that she doesn't have many friends. She had a little group in preschool and in kinder there was more of the - the whole class to my bday party thing. In second grade, she identified a few friends she enjoyed while at school. If I asked if she wanted to invite someone over for a playdate, the answer was usually no. Pre pandemic we basically never received any invites either. Occasionally I would try to set something up (and still do although more strained that ever). I see girls her age sit in front of the zoom for 30-45 minutes and have a conversation. She is in a reading level group with another kid who is highly conversational and my daughter says a few words when asked. How worried should I be? I do realize some of this is my issue (worried she will feel alone, sad she doesn't have many friends etc). She doesnt seem to mind in the slightest. She does have a younger sister 1.5 years younger and they play for hours together. Our 3rd is 4 so our house is active. When we go places with the family, she interacts with other kids and seems to be happy. She and her sister are really sick of zoom and so if I reach out to friends to have them meet via zoom, she is only half interested and I am feeling like I am forcing it on her. Would you wait until she is ready to make for friends or continue to push the issue or accept her needs actually being met with casual friendships and sisterhood? Prior to the pandemic, she didn't really want to sign up for activities and when she finally agreed to try hip-hop there was only one other little girl in the class (plus her sister). I grew up having a best friend over constantly from kinder to 6th so I am trying to understand how different needs can be in terms of needs for friends.  Words of wisdom please.  - Worried mama

    Dec 12, 2020

    I think the answer right now is her next youngest sister is her best friend. They're so close in age, it may well be the same post-pandemic, but see how it goes next year when (fingers crossed) they are back in physical school. I have a 10 yo girl who can and will spend hours on zoom chatting to one or two close friends but I don't know if she would have wanted to do that when she was 7 or 8. The girl packs seemed to solidify in 4th grade (upper grade, in our elementary school), and she got very tight with a couple of girlfriends and a larger group of 5-6. This dynamic may change post-COVID when many friendships have shifted.

    I'll just add the couple of "strong personality" girls we knew in elementary school changed a bit from 3rd to 4th grade probably due to maturity and parental intervention. A couple tried very hard to modulate their behavior and be more likable to fit in with the pack. A couple went "underground" with manipulative/sneaky behavior to form a counter-pack (not that it sounds like your daughter). Girl dynamics are very interesting!

    Dec 13, 2020

    I would ask the teacher how she is doing socially. Hopefully the teacher knew her in person before zoom classes.

    Then as long as there is no issue you don't know about (which teacher could tell you), let her be. She may be an introvert who likes people, but reenergizes by herself. She shouldn't feel that that is "wrong".

    Dec 15, 2020

    My child is exactly the same! We worry all the time. My husband is an introvert and doesn't "need" many friends while I'm an extrovert and they are my life line. 

    Thus, I feel like you and worry about her. She has big feelings as does yours and can get angry with friends who she feels like are not playing fair or if she is "wronged" on the flip side she does go out of her way to be helpful and make presents for everyone in the family. She does have a younger brother and they play and fight for hours as well. She likes to play with boys more than girls. I have no answers for you and hope that she does find a "someone" in her peer group. 

    Dec 16, 2020

    I think you have a daughter that may have a strong sense of self, is securely attached and doesn’t need to follow the pack. A few quality friends is all one needs. Winning the popularity contest in school is actually not a goal one should seek. Imagine she was a teenager:

    she has a few select friends

    is ok with herself, enough that she doesn’t need the approval of a pack

    I would recommend you read, “Hold on to Your Kids”, by Dr. Neufeld. It talks about how our culture pushes kids to “socialize”, and in that we risk them not fully maturing, being teens that follow the pack, and attachment to peers not parents. 

    Dec 16, 2020

    Hi! I never post here, but your message struck a chord. Your daughter sounds very, very much like my 8-year old daughter, who was just diagnosed this summer with high functioning autism. I am absolutely not suggesting that’s what you’re dealing with, but one thing this journey has taught me is that what may seem important to me - like having friends, or saying the socially appropriate thing - is not necessarily important to my daughter. She is very happy in what she loves - her little sisters, nature, birds, science, stuffies, school, playing random games with kids she’s just met in a park and never seeing them again - and her social awkwardness, indifference, and inflexibility are just a part of who she is. Since my daughter was diagnosed, we have succeeded in getting her an IEP, and she now has a group of terrifically supportive special ed teachers who work with her on managing her emotions, saying “good morning” and feigning interest in other people. But that work is mostly to help her learn how to make other people happy - she’s totally happy in who she is. I guess my broader message (since I want to reiterate I am not trying to suggest that your daughter might have HFA) is that unless it seems like your daughter’s social issues are making her unhappy or creating other issues, like in school or in terms of bullying, it’s okay to let her be who she is.

    Dec 16, 2020

    She sounds like a great kid! Everyone is different, and she seems happy and busy. I wouldn’t worry at all. 

    Dec 16, 2020

    Unless she seems unhappy because of not having more friend time I wouldn't worry about it. I was introverted as a child (still am) and my mother spent a lot of time trying to force friendships. It was generally counterproductive. As others have said, sister time is important (honestly maybe better to be developing the sister relationship than spending time with friends she will lose touch with when older anyway -- being a sister doesn't make them any less of a friend). And you seem to be creating some opportunities to interact with other kids if she wants that. You are smart to be thinking about these things and monitoring the situation because some kids truly are lonely. But it doesn't sound like your daughter is one of them. 

    Dec 16, 2020

    My daughter (only child) has a strong personality to put it mildly. She often would rather do her own thing than compromise to get along. In the “social thinking” world, I have been told this is not good. She would make friends easily but lose them quickly, too. It was hard to be her friend. 
    Starting in 6th grade this changed! She still navigates friendships on her own terms but is loving zooming with friends and posting a bit on social media - Instagram, tiktok, getting likes. She also has a true BFF. 
    Given that your kid can play for hours with a sibling I would not worry. Her most important relationship is still with you! 

    Dec 16, 2020

    Your description of your daughter sounds a lot like me when I was eight - except that I also found trees to climb and crawl spaces to spelunk when my caregiver grandmother was not looking.

    There is one school of thought that says that certain people - adults and children - manifest a "driver" personality.  They simply don't want to be bothered with people who have different interests or are perhaps less smart. They are okay - temporarily - with not having close friends, until they find playmates who are truly engaging. In teachable moments, it would be good to coach social skills, if this were the case.  The really socially successful two-percenters seem to have an innate ability to take an interest in whoever they find themselves with.  I wonder if this skill can be taught?

    At age eight, a girl is large enough, and probably coordinated enough, that she may want to take on an individual sport - gymnastics, martial arts, horseback riding.  That would be a way to meet like-minded kids.

    I would also suggest that you also check out your local Scout troop. In our experience, Girl Scouts were the luck of the draw as to the quality of the program, but we hit the jackpot with our son's Boy Scout troop, which is now all-gender.  The structure of the program, the ability of a child to develop self-esteem by setting themselves modest goals and achieving them - we found it wonderful.

    Dec 16, 2020

    So... because it’s on my mind, as an adult woman discovering she probably has autism, this sounds a LOT like me as a kid. It might be worth considering, as recognizing what is going on and having words as a kid for why they were different and struggled with social stuff is something many late diagnosed adult women wish they had. (And if you’re not familiar with it,  autism, especially in girls, is VERY different than the stereotype).

    But, either way, I’d try to really get a sense of whether it bothers her. Maybe, she’s actually happy on her own. Maybe, the girls at school aren’t very nice to her, (in my family’s experience, some girls get pretty mean for a while in 3rd grade) or she doesn’t know how to interact with them.

    I wouldn’t push zoom though. We’re all zoomed out. Who wants to spend any more time on zoom than they have to? But, post-pandemic. I’d think about whether it’s lack of desire, or lack of skills/girls willing to be her friend, in considering what supports she needs.

    Dec 17, 2020

    I feel for you. We have an 8 year old daughter. It is impossible to make new friends while we are distance learning and avoiding human interaction. Her best friends are still her preschool friends. She made no real friend in K and we continued to keep up with preschool friends. She made a best friend in 1st grade, we were so happy! That friend moved to Portland. She made a couple of other decent friends and one moved to Sacramento and the other left for private school. I am sad that our daughter doesn’t have a good friend at school. But, we have worked very hard to keep up the preschool connections so that she continues to have some friends. It’s a little sad but now I try to gauge the likelihood of the family sticking around when I consider making efforts to build friendship. Many of her preschool friends have moved as well — Oregon, so cal, etc. This school year — no new friend. It’s a $!,&@“.’#%*^># year for us all. Chatting on zoom is really boring for young kids. My kid doesn’t participate in these chats either. My kid does like playing games online with a friend while having the zoom screen on the side. Nintendo switch has been fun but we also have played guess who or battle ship online. 

    On the subject of strong personality... our child is vibrant and has strong opinions but is an extrovert who wants playmates. I have noticed a stark difference in my kids who are extroverts v introverts. Perhaps you can check in with your kid and see if she is lonely or wanting friends other than her sibling. She may be content with her social life. 

    Dec 17, 2020

    My girls are younger than yours, so I don't have advice as a parent.  But as an introverted child of an extroverted mother who often felt like I was disappointing or worrying my mom because I wasn't social enough - I'd recommend you try really hard to be understanding that children can have differing needs for friendship and socializing, and not to allow your daughter to sense your worry about this.  You should definitely continue to monitor the situation to see if there are more concerning problems with socialization, but simply the fact that she doesn't have the same number or intensity of friends you had at that age isn't a problem if she doesn't think it's a problem.  I'd focus on creating a safe and supportive environment for socializing and friend-making that does encourage her to push outside her comfort zone on occasion -- but too much pressure is not going to help. So follow her cues, especially if she seems otherwise happy -- occasion questions about whether she like you to set up a playdate or if she's like to join a new group are great (and if she has any tendency toward introversion or social anxiety, there may be an opportunity for you to take on some of the "hard" parts of organizing to set her up for success), but don't ask so often that she feels like she's disappointing you every time she says no. And please avoid any language like, "why don't you want to go play with your friends? It would be so much fun!"  That may just make her feel like something is wrong with her because she'd rather read or play outside.

    Dec 17, 2020

  • Private School that Supports Social Skills?

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    Sep 8, 2020

    My 8-year-old son is in a large OUSD public elementary and it has become pretty clear that he needs a school with more support around social skills. He has always been an introvert and gravitates towards adults. In the 3 years he has been at his school he hasn't made any real friends. He struggles with a lot of anxiety and insecurity but also seems to have a hard time reading some social ques. Our current school does a good job of talking about being inclusive and accepting but I find that without caring capable adults on the playground to help guide kids towards these kinds of behaviors, inclusiveness isn't going to happen. We are hoping there is a private school in the area that does a good job of helping young kids with this kind of stuff. Does your private school have caring adults on the playground to help kids navigate tricky social issues? If so, please share your experience.

    Thanks in advance!  

    Sep 8, 2020

    I'm sorry to hear that your son is having struggles with friends. I can recommend Aurora School in upper Rockridge in Oakland. They have super supportive and caring teachers and staff. They have a "buddy bench" where kids can go and sit when they don't have anyone to play with. The kids know to befriend anyone sitting on the buddy bench. The school blends grades, so K/1, 2/3, and 4/5s are together and they all have teaching assistants as well. It is currently a K-5 school, but will be starting a middle school next year which we are all super excited about! The school prides itself on it's social emotional curriculum and their remote schoolhouse program has been amazing. We have nothing but great things to say about Aurora. Please check it out.  

    Sep 9, 2020

    I suggest looking at Walden Center & School in Berkeley.  I have a 4th grade boy there and have been consistently impressed with the social/emotional skills development.  The teachers and recess and afterschool staff are very involved and take time to work with the kids on relationship skills.  They also encourage the kids to develop the skills necessary to resolve conflicts themselves in a fair way.  My kiddo is introverted and often lacks self-confidence but has really found his voice there in a way I don't think would have happened in a larger school.

    Sep 9, 2020

    Hi, Our kids (1st grade and 3rd grade) go to Crestmont School (https://crestmontschool.org/) and we picked this school for the emphasis on community-building and social emotional support. The school is a small coop with an amazing student:teacher ratio, teachers aids, support services, a school-wide emphasis on kindness and non-violent communication and meaningful fostering of inter-grade relationships. Everyone knows each others names (adults and kids alike) and in non-COVID times we have tons of community event throughout the year where we really bond as a group.  And side-note - it is likely that the school will be given the green light to re-open in the coming months. Let me know if you want to know more.  

    Sep 9, 2020

    Look into Aurora. We’ve been there for the past three years and love it. Their focus is social emotional learning. Good luck. 

    Sep 9, 2020

    My kids have social skills issues, and I have toured many private schools in the east bay. Although schools these days have an increased emphasis on inclusion, I don’t believe there is a mainstream private school that can dedicate enough resources to give what it sounds like he needs.  My unsolicited advice—I would actually recommend an evaluation from his current school district. Definitely sounds like you have reasonable grounds. Even though it sounds like he doesn’t have a diagnosis like high-functioning ASD and so probably wouldn’t qualify for an IEP, the evaluation process can be very helpful to help parents and teachers get a kid social supports they need. And the report would be useful to you a future private school if he transfers.

    Sep 9, 2020

    We have a very similar child and have him at St. Paul's in Oakland specifically because we think they excel in this area. The school uses the Responsive Classroom model and has everyone from administrators to classroom teachers to after school staff trained in the approach so that kids are hearing consistent messages and language around social-emotional skills throughout the day and across the grades. That's not to say that there is no social conflict--but in our experience staff are quick to see and use these moments as teaching opportunities, lifting up the particular strategies kids can use. In these crazy times, social-emotional learning is a hugely challenging space for schools to hold, but I've been impressed with how St. Paul's has continued to integrate the "People Power" skills into their distance learning model, helping kids name and navigate their emotions. We very much preferred to have our child in public school, but found very few schools where we could see a clear approach to social-emotional skill building across grade levels, particularly in the classroom vs. in a pull-out group. (Several identified SEL curricula that they used, but how well this was held in the classroom seemed to vary hugely by teacher.) The consistency on social-emotional supports between the school day and aftercare program was also hugely important to us--our child spends several hours each day in aftercare in normal times, and that time tends to be less structured so it's when social issues seem most likely to bubble up--and that was very tough to find. Good luck with the search!

    Sep 9, 2020

    Black Pine Circle School in Berkeley!!!

    Sep 10, 2020

    We're also at Crestmont School in Richmond.  We picked it because of it's social-emotional focus years ago for our oldest (now in 4th grade) and we couldn't be happier after all of these years.  Its built into every aspect of the curriculum, so all the kids pick it up.  It gets worked into how the play on the playground as well with how they talk to each other and react when someone is hurt (physically or emotionally).  The teachers there are some of the best trained and most qualified I've ever met.  They spent the summer doing courses about "teaching through trauma" to help the kids deal with all that 2020 has brought so far.  Amazing.

    Sep 17, 2020

    We've been at The Berkeley School for the several years and social/emotional learning is great. I have an extroverted/sensitive kiddo and I've appreciated how much the teachers and staff have understood what he needs emotionally and have helped him grow. I'm really proud when I hear him talk about treating others with respect and how we're all different and special. Smaller schools have an advantage in this area. The Berkeley School are other great attributes and it shines particularly well in this area.

    Oct 2, 2020

  • Kindergarten - Trouble Making Friends

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    Dec 12, 2019

    Our 5 year-old has been having a difficult time making friends during their first year in kindergarten. We suspect a big part of the reason is that they speak baby talk to their peers and make obnoxious baby noises frequently in their interactions. We have tried to address this kindly and directly multiple times, but haven't had much success and are concerned this will have longer lasting negative repercussions the longer it goes on. Is this just a phase? Has anybody else gone through this? Any suggestions or similar experiences and solutions would be very much appreciated.

    Dec 12, 2019

    I too have been dismayed by my 5-year-old's persistent (though less frequent than before) use of baby talk and worried about it affecting social interactions in her new kindergarten, but have discovered that nearly all her peers use it from time to time - in fact, that's probably why the behavior is so persistent! I don't know if it's a comforting regression or a button-pusher or a form of dramatic play or what. That may be the case with your child as well.

    Does your child complain or act sad about other kids, or do you just not see evidence of group play and one-on-one friendships? If the former, then I agree that is a tough situation and you may want the teacher's input on what classroom interactions are like. If the latter, it may just be that the kids need to take time to get to know their new environment and one another (parent-initiated playdates can help with this). I have made sure that my child has regular playdates with her preschool friends (who all fanned out to different primary schools) so she feels grounded and "friended" as she navigates the new school. As far as I can tell the transition from preschool to kinder is a major upheaval and kids all deal with it differently and in their own time. Good luck.

    Dec 18, 2019

    My child struggled socially in Kinder. She was sad and really missed her preschool friends. We reached out to her teacher and after school program staff for help and got a list of recommended friends to nurture friendship. We  worked hard to set up play dates and sign up for after school programs and camps with these kids. My kid in first grade is doing well socially now that she has a core group of friends at school. She still misses her preschool friends to whom she feels very connected. They are still her best friends but she is more anchored socially at school. We also try to go to the local library and playground where we often run into schoolmates. 
     

    the baby talk seems very common and normal. My now first grader is very articulate, has a huge vocabulary and reads 400+ page chapter books but still loves to pretend to be a baby and does baby talk. During kinder year, it was worse. This year, it’s better except now she pretends to be a cat and meows ...... During parent teacher conference, even the kinder teacher brought it up as apparently my kid was influencing the whole class to engage in baby talk which became annoying to the teacher!  It will likely pass.

    Dec 18, 2019

  • 2nd grade daughter's aggressive friend

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    Dec 9, 2019

    There is a classmate / neighborhood kid about the same age as my daughter (2nd grader). When they are together, this boy is "mean" to her. At least, I perceive it as mean, aggressive, and not appropriate. He shows up at our front door to play with her sometimes. I like the idea of having neighborhood kids play, and we don't have many kids within an easy walking distance. I turned around to tend to other stuff while they were playing outside. I heard commotion and saw my daughter running away from him who was trying to shoot her with a toy bow and arrow. We ran into him at a pool and he started shooting water at her. The boy was with a sitter who was not nearby at the time to supervise the child. At both times, I heard my daughter clearly and firmly tell him to stop. I think he thinks it's funny. When I heard the commotion, I ran over and told him sternly that it was not appropriate. I asked my daughter if this boy does similar things at school, and she said "sometimes he gets a little crazy". I am not a boy. I do not have boys. I do not have brothers. I have mild tempered kids who like to paint, sew, sing, cook, garden, decorate her fairy garden, and dance. So, I am a bit stumped on how to react to kids whose first reaction is "throw stuff around, shoot/throw stuff at other kids, decorations and flowers immediately become target practices." I hung pretty bows and ornaments on a tree on our front lawn, and I did not anticipate that it would become such an attractive target for this boy to jump and grab, thereby breaking some branches. I have not spoken to the parents but I'm not sure whether it's even worth bringing it up to the parents or if I do, how I should bring it up. This boy has 2 other brothers and when I have seen the siblings together, I can definitely see that they play rough and the 3 boys fight pretty intensely. I would love to hear from the perspective of parents of boys. I am kind of nervous about this boy coming over to play, because of his big energy.

    Am I overreacting? Any advice?

    Dec 9, 2019

    Just say no to playdates, unless your daughter wants to play, in which case supervise them.  Ask her.

    Dec 10, 2019

    My boy gets similarly picked on by other girls and boys. I think if you stopped focusing on his gender you might get better advice or be able to come up with a solution for yourself. Because please. This is not a boy thing. It’s how parents raise their kids and what other influences the kid could be exposed to thing. In these situations I’ve talked to the parents, teachers, and worked with my kid to build resiliency, in addition to finding ways to keep them apart. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    I have a 5 year old boy. Sometimes he (like most other kids I've encountered, including my 11-year old daughter) needs to be reminded that when someone asks him to stop "playing" with them in a way that isn't fun for them too he needs to respect their feelings and stop.  Same for being respectful of other people's property.  It's probably going to take a lot of practice/reminders before he nails it, but hopefully he will eventually internalize these ideas.  

    The parents can't do anything about it if they don't know what's going on, so my advice would be to at least try to have a conversation with them.  I am always grateful when people let me know about my children misbehaving so that I can address it with the kids.  Most people just say I wanted let you know that ... 

    We've also encountered kids that are out of control, some to the point that I don't want to have them over.  I agree with the other poster that if you daughter doesn't want to play with this kid you can just tell him no ( I would tell him why too -- e.g. she would like to play with you, but last time you did x, y, z which made her uncomfortable/unhappy, I know you can do better if you try hard and when you are ready to change that behavior maybe she would like to play, but she's not going to play with you if you don't listen to what she is telling you and respect her feelings, so let's take a break until you straighten that out).  If she does want to play then I would offer a playdate in a nearby park instead of inside and give him ground rules before the playdate. That way they can run around and burn off some energy and you won't have to worry about them messing up your place.  

    Dec 11, 2019

    Hi. I'm the parent of a 2nd grade boy who could be described as energetic. Definitely some of the descriptors you used for your neighbor sound familiar. He's not quite as destructive as you describe, but he will turn any pointy toy (fairy wand, etc.) into a weapon. I didn't teach him to do this, and I try to discourage it if the other children in the room aren't playing this kind of game. And yet. Every stick is a weapon, and every game is a super hero battle. I work on it, I promise I do.

    I think it's important to keep in mind that there are a lot of kinds of kids in the world. Some of them are really active and take a long time to learn impulse control. It's okay for your child to come to the conclusion that she doesn't actually like playing with this boy, or for you to decide that you'd prefer not to have his energy in your house. It seems like for this boy and his brothers, the physical way they play seems to work for them, and maybe their parents feel like it's in accordance with their values. It's possible to place boundaries for your house and family without placing judgments about other kids' behavior.

    If it involves destroying your property, or if your daughter is afraid to go outside, then checking in with the parents seems like a good idea. I think it's most helpful to approach the other parents as peers who you want to work with to solve the problem. They might not think his behavior is a big deal, but they might listen to reasonable requests. I think asking him not to touch your decorations and also stopping a game if your daughter says no or if it is not fun for her are two reasonable requests. You can't really control how he acts at school or whether he roughhouses with his brothers, but I'd say you have a say how he treats your yard and family.

    Dec 11, 2019

    This isn't a boy thing - it's a kid thing.  It might be helpful to check those ideas that boys throw stuff around, shoot/throw stuff at other kids, decorations and flowers immediately become target practices and that girls like to paint, sew, sing, cook, garden, decorate fairy gardens, and dance.  

    Ask your daughter how she's feeling about her interactions with this child and if she'd like to continue them. And also feel free to just say no if you don't want this child to interact with yours.

    Dec 11, 2019

    My boy has always been gentle and fairly quiet, so it isn't completely a gender thing.  Regardless of gender, your daughter is saying "no" in order to protect herself, and that should be enough.  Tell him kindly but firmly that he'll have to go home if he can't respect other people.  Those are the rules of your house.  If there's no immediate change, then follow through and politely show him the door, assuring him his is welcome back when he can make better choices including being gentle with your daughter's toys, others' feelings, and your home (right down to the lawn ornaments).  I would definitely be polite because he may not be getting good directions at home.  It does take a village and you may be the one to start teaching him that there are boundaries and rules for healthy friendships. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    I have two rambunctious boys, one who is seven. Thank you for recognizing that your perspective might be skewed. The behavior you describe is normal - it’s not “mean” or “inappropriate.” The only problem is if the play isn’t consensual. The boy should be learning not to engage in this behavior with someone who doesn’t think it’s fun. The problem is that many children, especially the mild mannered ones, do not clearly communicate their preferences. I know you say that your child clearly communicated that she didn’t want to play, but I’ve witnessed this happen to my son so many times that my first instinct is to be doubtful. So often the children are laughing and playing and then one suddenly changes her mind and complains to an adult without saying anything to my son. My son is genuinely confused, because he thought they were having fun. If it is being clearly communicated to this boy that your daughter is not enjoying this kind of play and he persists, then that indicates that he has some impulse control issues that probably need to be addressed.

    Dec 11, 2019

    I have a mild-mannered boy (and girl) and don't invite over friends that I know will trash the house. If there is a gathering of such gregariousness, we know to head to a park where they can be who they want to be and the tribe of kids will police themselves. Parents of 'wild boys' know they have them and some will perhaps notice that their kid will or won't get invited to things that other kids are doing. I've seen some parents of 'wild boys' connect w/ other parents of similar kids, finding ways to get them together, and appreciate their boys can be themselves in some 'safe' environment free of criticism or judgement.

    My advice to you: AVOID parenting another family's child (unless they have asked you to) and focus on raising girls that know how to advocate for themselves in various environments. I wonder if an analogy would be a visiting parent to observe your daughter and sarcastically say "well, you're quite the delicate introvert, aren't you? But it's OK, not everyone needs to athletic." If a parent of a wild-child of any gender were to ask me for advice based on what i've observed about the various kids in our community (now that mine are in Middle School) I would say that if 'like-ability' is important for your child to have as they get older, they should find ways to direct their child's energy into athletics (or organized outdoor pursuits) where a great coach can be an amazing force to help them channel active-ness into goals and success. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    It sounds like the kids' play style are not a great fit so maybe they should not be playing together, or at least not without supervision.  Some boys are great at playing with girls and some boys have a very "active" type of play and very energetic which does not work for a shy or quiet kid -- those boys are not mean and are not doing anything bad on purpose they just get into the game in a way that often seems too much for others.  I have an elementary aged son that is similar to that boy (minus the shooting pretend arrows, though he does sword fights instead).  He likes to play loud and rough games and my daughter is basically not allowed to play those games with him since she always gets hurt and ends up in tears and the rule in our house is if you willingly agreed to play a game that was rough and which had a high chance of you getting hurt, you are not allowed to complain if you ended up getting hurt.  I taught my son that the games themselves are not bad but that he needs to think twice about who he can play those games with and be selective about the group of boys he invites over for playdates if he intends to play that game and to only invite kids that like these type of games or know in advance he won't be allowed to play them.  I think it is up to your daughter to tell the neighbor boy that she does not like those type of games and then it is up to him to either play with someone else or play different games with her. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    Instead of asking “Is this normal boy behavior?” you might want to ask “Does my daughter enjoy playing with this child?” Even if the answer to the former is yes, if the answer to the latter is no, then don’t play together.

    Dec 11, 2019

    HI, parent of 2 boys here and I'm constantly shocked by how they play and how different they are from me at that age.  That said, I think it's really great for kid of different play styles to figure out how to be together, especially neighbors, and my guess is that this kids' mom is happy to get a break!  This type of play is common among the boys I see, however what all kids need to learn is how to both respect boundaries and state their own boundaries, and that's where this little guy could use help.  Your daughter needs an adult to help her when she states a boundary and he crosses it.  Step in and re-direct their play and be that boundary for her until he gets it.  If he doesn't adapt, he goes home.  My kid will often start to act more aggressively/over the top when he feels like he isn't able to connect with a playmate.  What has been helpful for my boys in connecting wiht other kids is to help them find things they like to do together.  Say they both like legos, or biking, or pretending to be tigers, or dancing to music, or putting on plays--help them structure their play to something both enjoy. my guess is that will help this kid redirect his energy into constructive play and once they've established a 'way' they both like to play they can move on from there.  If you know the parents, involve them in this conversation, my guess is that they also may be struggling with his respect of limits.  If you don't know them/they have different parenting philosophies, it's not your job to teach this kid to respect boundaries, but everyone benefits, so I recommend if you have the capacity to be that stand in parent for him. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    It just might not be a good fit with the neighborhood boy. I don't think you should bring it up with his parents, unless they're asking for play dates and you decline, because there's nothing wrong with him either.

    I am a girl, grew up with only sisters, we were the docile kind, and from what I gather quiet and easy to raise.

    I have a son, imagine the cartoon Tazmanian devil twirling around, that's kind of like my son. I'm still getting used to it, but I have had many folks (other Moms with boys, preschool teachers, nannies, pediatrician) confirm for me that this is within the range of normal. "Big energy" is a good way to describe it, some boys are full of life and raw energy and do everything kind of big and uncontrolled. But because I know this, I monitor him more carefully around girly girls. He once put an older girl in a choke hold by accident due to vigorous hugging from behind. He's also chased after girls and hit them because he wanted to play with them but didn't know how, and hitting them got him their attention, so he kept up the antics. One last funny boy story - just yesterday, he and my partner were sharing a very sweet moment by our Christmas tree, and out of nowhere my son whacked a ball ornament off the tree. Just because it's there, and it was too tempting. I can't imagine doing that myself, ever, but to him that was just the thing to do...

    One thing that works for me with my son is that when his friends don't look like they're enjoying the rough play, I tell him if he keeps it up we're leaving. In other words, saying "stop" to the neighborhood boy requires him to do something he might not be able to right away because he's too wrapped up in play. But saying "stop it or else I'm going to leave" is something your daughter can control, and if he wants to keep playing with her, he might stop. After a while, he will get it.

    Dec 11, 2019

    Ps. And no, not all boys run around throwing things. Some play very quietly and can be very subdued. I’m not making a value statement as to which type of play is better. It’s just that they are different. So that’s why it’s more important to ask whether your daughter enjoys this boy’s company than whether this rough play is “normal”. If she doesn’t like playing with this boy, it doesn’t mean she won’t play with any boys. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    Sounds like pretty normal 2nd grade boy stuff to me.

    Dec 11, 2019

    I think this is a great teachable moment.

    First off, I have two boys and one girl. I feel your pain; and I often feel divided between raising a girl vs boys. My boys are on the low end of the rough housing factor...but there are times when I am not able to deal with the physicality and noise levels involved. The truth is, boys tend to have more testosterone and get a surge around the second grade. They need to somehow play. It’s likely they aren’t playing hard enough, running around outside, or this boy needs a little more guidance on how to disperse his energy. The opportunity for you might be to have a conversation with your daughter about the behavior she sees and to give her some language on how to deal with him, “I will not play with you when you are rough” (which she did when you heard her tell him to stop - perhaps reinforce that was a good choice and let her know the “no” means just that. These small conversions can be so empowering for children, so I’ve learned). Instead of just writing off this boy, if you have the energy (and choose wisely), allow for another day of play, see how it goes (it will probably be the same) and coach her through areas she needs help on. With the underlying message of: “I show people how I want to be treated.” Personally, I’ve come to love (after a period of initial hate) these times because when they’re not at school, I can’t coach my kids (that sounds really helicopter-y), but the more practice the better...with guidance. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    I suggest that you try having the boy over at least once more. Make some rules, like no weapons, no fighting. What ever you think may be a problem. Set a time limit. And watch them closely. Or set them up with some quiet activity like a game or coloring. Make rules. Limit the time. Good luck. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    It is so nice that you are second guessing your gut response to these behaviors. I am a woman, but had only male siblings and male children. Maybe because of this,  I love the rough housing, physical contact and sheer energy of young boys. Some boys (and girls) are filled with so much enthusiasm it comes out physically. That said, they should not destroy your property or make others (your daughter) feel unsafe. Let them know that you worked hard to put up the decorations, and ask them to leave them be. Remind them that your daughter said no, and does not want to play that roughly. Be sincere, kind and offer an alternative activity. It may be that your daughter and this boy just like different forms of play. I think it’s okay for kids to know and understand that. 

    Dec 11, 2019

    Hello! I don't think you're overreacting, and I'd love to *try* to give advice. I have a six-year-old boy, and he is active and sometimes his preferred play is odd to me. My kid loves to wrestle and chase and call names and such, and he doesn't see calling each other names as mean, but just funny and likes when it happens back-and-forth with another kid. I think it is liking a style of play rather than boy vs. girl -- I've seen boys who are intimidated or dislike that kind of play, and last weekend my kid was at a birthday party where a girl his age and him started wrestling and running riding toys into each other, and pulling at each other and pushing each other over and screaming, and they both were having a super fun time, whereas I was like, are they going to injure each other? So I think it is just a major difference in play style, and just as you and your daughter seem confused by his style and think it is mean, he is probably just as confused about her style and why you don't want him to play, especially if his brothers play that way too and they are his primary playmates. If he and your daughter want to play with each other and have playdates, I have a few ideas:

    1. Explain to your daughter that he isn't trying to hurt her or be mean, that's just how he's trying to play with her. (First, make sure this is true by observing -- does it look like bullying or trying to hurt, or just playing? Might be hard to tell the difference if you're not used to it...)

    2. Explain to the boy that your daughter doesn't like rough play / fighting play and feels attacked by it. Be aware that this might make him feel bad, like his kind of play is "wrong" and he might be sensitive about it. Try asking him what else he likes to play. (For example, my son also likes art and building things with blocks and playing hiding/finding games like scavenger hunts and easter egg hunts). Attempt to find common ground. 

    3. If the boy comes into your yard/house for a playdate, expect that you may need to supervise pretty much the whole time. He won't be familiar with the boundaries and rules of your home, which you and your kids probably take for granted as obvious. For example, it might be obvious to you not to try to hang on the curtains/drapes, but that might not be obvious to him if he has blinds/shades at his home and doesn't know the rod would pull out of the wall. This might be an extreme example, but you get the idea. Be ready to let him know in advance that there are some rules at your home that might be different, and you'll try hard to let him know about those rules. 

    4. It is entirely reasonable not to be comfortable with an active kid (or any kid) you don't know well coming into your home to play partially unsupervised. You can always keep them outside or invite his parent to bring him over for supervised playdate & coffee/tea with you. 

    5. It's one thing to be active and another to be destructive. Don't be afraid to tell the boy to be gentle with the plants, not touch the breakables, etc. 

    6. I think it's quite reasonable to talk to the parents. You can ask their advice. Let them know your daughter plays calmly/quietly and you're not used to a more active kid but want to facilitate a healthy play relationship. You'll get a sense of whether the kid is just active, or out of control. 

    Good luck! Hope this helps!

    Dec 11, 2019

    There are lots of boys (and some girls) with big energy like that. I wouldn’t say it’s inappropriate. He doesn’t sound like a good match for your quiet child/household though.
     

    If your daughter wants to play with him, I’d suggest going to the playground & supervising. Intervene if there’s actual danger. If your daughter asks you for help because she doesn’t like the physical way he plays, teach her how to stand up for herself, move away from him, or end the play date.  

    Dec 12, 2019

    I wish I had advice, but I think all I have is a reflection on my own experiences. As the mother of a boy and a girl, I do find mine to be wired differently. My son is big-energy-wild at age 4, but also very sweet, thoughtful, caring, flexible and remarkably reasonable.  I did notice early on that when he and I were around parents of only girls (especially in close quarters), they often seemed taken aback by his energy - for example, in the midst of his happy excited dance, he will knock into someone or something; he likes to jump on me when I'm sitting on the floor and climb on me like a jungle gym. He is also sensitive, and will cry or growl when he feels slighted, hurt, or frustrated. Although I'm happy to cater to his big motor needs within our family, I do struggle with how to help him "code switch" in other social situations. Sometimes it has made me feel like a bad parent. I envy my parent friends who say their boys only have girl friends, but my son gravitates toward the big, gross motor play that mostly only other boys seem to like. I have pretty high standards for kindness and he can talk quite eloquently, and reflect on and connect his experiences; he is very affectionate, and he loves cuddles, and he is very social and friendly, so it's not like he doesn't have a ton going for him, and I love him dearly as he is. But since my daughter has turned one, it has become increasingly clear that they are just different. She already has opinions about clothes which he still doesn't particularly express. She will patiently hand me blocks to stack a tower higher whereas he was years older than she is now before he transitioned to building instead of toppling.

    All that said, I don't subscribe to the "boys will be boys" philosophy - or I think comes from some kind of true experience, but it doesn't mean that we have to leave it unchecked and untrained. But just know that for that boy's parents, it is almost certainly so much more effort to check it than it is likely to be for you with your daughter - they likely would need to be near-constantly on him in order to influence the direction of the play. And I've noticed that some parents give up to some extent, and pick their battles with frugality because they just don't have it in them - especially if he is the third of three boys.

    I think in the end you need to support your daughter and do what feels most comfortable to you and her. Maybe that means cutting off the playdates. Maybe it means supervising closely. Maybe it means getting the other parents involved to set expectations. Maybe it means your daughter practicing shouting no as loudly as she can at him (when I taught girl's self-defense years and years ago, that was one of our first lessons). If you do continue to let them play, I think you should feel totally within your rights to set limits and boundaries (e.g., they can't break the tree branches, they can't play guns in your yard), and be ready to enforce consequences if they are broken (e.g., playdate is over, time out, whatever). I would hope that if you approached the other parents with compassion and explained that you don't have experience with boys, and asked for their support and tips on what to do, they would support you back, and maybe they would pay a little extra attention to this child to try to work with him on it a bit more. However you proceed, good luck!

    Dec 12, 2019

    It sounds to me like he would like to play with your daughter, but doesn't know how to engage with her. If he has older brothers and there is a lot of rough housing, to him inviting someone in play is being physical with them. If your daughter wants to play with him, the next time he comes over, perhaps you could suggest they play something your daughter likes to do. I would help them begin the game before walking away to make sure they are getting along.

    Dec 12, 2019

  • 8 yr that suddenly doesn't like to be around younger kids

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    Sep 16, 2019

    My normally very sweet 8 year old has suddenly in the last few months, started to dislike playing with or being around younger kids.  She says they are "annoying," which of course may be the case, but she has such a determined negativity.  She wouldn't hurt anyone but does say mean things. Is this an age-related thing or is there something else going on?

    She's also gotten some negative attitude towards friendly classmates, that she would normally be (or has been) accepting of.

    Mom in Oakland

    Sep 16, 2019

    Thanks for posting.  I am in a similar boat since last year and I thought things would be different in a larger classroom with more kids this year.  I'm not sure that the situation has improved for my 8 year old daughter who doesn't say she is annoyed, but she looks sufficiently annoyed at drop-off.  She easily gravitates towards slightly older or more mature children but it would be nice if she could show similar enthusiasm (or empathy?) towards her same-aged peers.  There is of course the occasional exception.

    Sep 18, 2019

    what could appear to be anger could be masking as anxiety.  Watch her behavior and see how she is acting, she may be nervous and upset because of anxiety.  Sounds like she is suffering with emotions she cannot control.  It happened to my child.  We got her therapy and it helped.  Comfort her and take her away from the environment that is upsetting her.  She clearly is going through something.  Good luck 

    Sep 18, 2019

    My oldest is just emerging from this stage (he turned 9 in May). We spent most of age 6, 7 and 8 in the mindset you described. At this point, it didn’t seem to be an extroversion/introversion nuance; he seemed to like one or two kids at a time and got “irritated” at his lack of being able to manage other behaviors, noises, rough housing, etc. What has helped him is holding his hand to show him it’s safe to be with himself and to focus on “fixing” or “improving” certain things he can control. Like, playing outside and building a treehouse and being in charge there.  At school, we drive home the idea that kids will do what they do - it’s not up to you to be bossy (he did attempt to be a boss for a few months) but to be an example of how you want to be. He chose to focus on getting a math award, which means he puts his efforts into working hard, specifically at math. A little success something goes a long way. When he fails, we tell him everyone around him is also failing and you have to get right back up, think about where the downfall was and try to do it a little bit better next time. Shifting the energy in these areas has helped tremendously. To this day, he can interact with more personalities but he is quietly choosy about who he’s friends with and I think that’s just fine.

    Sep 19, 2019

    I think this is normal, speaking as a mom of three kids in their teens and up.  Your daughter is becoming more selective about how she wants to spend her time, as people do when they are maturing. It's always good to remind her to be polite, though, and to be kind to younger children. But really she should not be expected to hang out with kids she doesn't relate to, so make sure she has clubs/classes with kids that are in her tribe.

    Oct 2, 2019

  • Is this appropriate for a mother to say "Don't play with that kid"

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    Nov 3, 2018

    My son AA tells me about his "mean friend" (BB) who threatens him with "I won't be your friend anymore if you don't...(usually it is only over a toy).  But this friend reduces him to tears by telling him that AA's best friend doesn't like him anymore, and prefers to be with BB (which is also a lie in addition to being mean).  They tease a mutual friend together and makes this friend cry (this is not what my son would ever do, w/o BB around).  After my son accidentally hit him with a  frisbee last week, he hit AA more than 9 times in the face.  My son told teachers and friends that he fell down instead!

    I don't think this is a healthy friendship and do not think BB is a kind friend.  I've been telling my son not to play with BB at recess, and wonder if this is inappropriate for a grown-up to do.  I worry that I am being a helicopter mom, that I'm intervening too much.  And it is difficult for other kids and parents to hear that ""AA's mom told him not to play with BB"

    But the alternative is to let my son continue to follow him around like a puppy when the friend is so unkind.  We will start karate lessons and playgroups to learn how to navigate friendships.  But what do I do now?

    Nov 3, 2018

    You'll probably get a range of replies, but I would say it is TOTALLY appropriate to tell your kid to avoid a kid who is obviously a manipulative bully, outrageous! My kids are a bit older so I don't even have to tell them, by now they KNOW to avoid what my friend would call 'ugly' acting people. Do you hang out with people who are manipulative or verbally abusive? Of course not! So why wouldn't you advise your kid - who needs you help learning how to navigate the world (we are not born knowing how), to avoid people who are not kind? Go for it mama!

    Nov 7, 2018

    Instead of telling your son not to play with a particular child, give your son tools to decide to do this himself. It's an important life lesson that I still struggle with as an adult. Ask him (and teach him to ask himself):

    -Does being with this friend make you feel good?

    -Is it OK for friends to hurt your feelings or body?

    -What are some things you can do instead of play with this friend?

    If your son can learn to come to his own decisions about friendships, he will be much better off than just doing what h thinks you want him to do.

    Nov 7, 2018

    I think it's fine to talk to him about what's problematic about the relationship. The danger in saying you don't want him playing with the kid is what I saw with my son's friend. He was instructed not to play with a child at school. No surprise, he would lie. Now, the reasons were sillier than yours but don't set your kid up to want to keep info from you. Good luck!

    Nov 7, 2018

    Oooh your post felt familiar.  Because I have done just that.  I have told my friend that she needs to stop playing with BB.  The only variables that are different than your story are that I know the family of BB and felt there had been a long history of reporting to them various individual incidents that happened over time.  And my telling my daughter not to play with her came after many many incidents and me seeing no change in BB's behavior over time.  It didn't seem to be some passing phase that would end soon.  Also, I told BB's parents what I was doing.  Yep, it was awkward.  But I got a lot of insight out of the conversation.  BB's parents didn't think the behavior was that bad.  That gave me a nice clear indication that the behavior was not being checked at home and was unlikely to change.  Once I talked with those parents and made the decision to tell my kid she needed to stop playing with BB, I felt so much better.  No more tears and sad stories.  Also, in addition to this I got some therapy for my daughter so she could better learn how to deal with mean kids.  It is helping.  Also since that kid is in her social circle at school she doesn't avoid her completely.  They still play here and there usually when other friends are around.  But my daughter no longer seeks her out.  And I'm relieved.  I hope this helps.

    Nov 7, 2018

    You don't state your child's age, which is pretty key to age-appropriate advice. But he sounds pretty young and impressionable and not yet able to navigate this on his own. BB sounds like an alpha who your child desperately wants the approval of, so there's self-confidence and loneliness issues that broader socialization may address.

    Probably re-directing your child's energy will be more useful than absolutely forbidding interactions. I'd suggest you talk to his teachers about the dynamic and see if they can steer your son (and the mutual friend) towards other kids and group games during recess.

    You can also arrange playdates with just your son and the mutual friend without the troublemaker and see how those go. Don't be surprised if your son continues to act out aggressively because of his identification with BB; without BB around you'll have a chance to intervene. If your son and the mutual friend become more bonded, BB may find himself on the outs--which wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

    Nov 7, 2018

    Have you talked to your child's teacher about this situation? I have found that teachers are very observant of social interactions and they have an outside perspective, which can be very helpful with this sort of dilemma. If the mean friend is making kids cry, that is bullying, and that needs to be reported. 

    Nov 8, 2018

  • How Can I Help My 3rd Grade Daughter Develop More Friendships?

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    Nov 1, 2018

    I've been struggling the last few months seeing my daughter have ups and downs with her close friends at school. She had a best friend in preschool and they’re still friends but now go to different schools. She made a new best friend in Kindergarten but that friend left after second grade. Now there are a couple of girls my daughter is fairly close to in class, but sometimes I sense that she wants to be closer with one of them, but that girl seems to have drifted apart a bit from my daughter.

    I think in general I just want my daughter to have a best friend, or a couple of really close friends, and lately I’ve been worrying that she’s lonely. She’s an only child. Sometimes I think I’m just overthinking it but at times it really causes me anxiety to think she doesn’t have a close friend at school. I know the girls in her class can be a bit sassy sometimes, and my daughter is pretty sensitive. I’ve made several play dates with some of the girls in her class and I’ll plan to continue that. 

    I know she’s doing OK but if anyone has any advice on how I can help her or support her, I’d truly appreciate it:)

    Nov 1, 2018

    Could have written this about my own third grade girl. I try to keep the lines of communication open with her about "friend issues", we read the nonfiction American Girl friendship guides together, and do occasional role-playing about how to reach out to new people. I try to actively discourage talk about one best friend and talk instead about "classroom friends", neighborhood friends, etc. I would like for her to do a team sport but she's really not interested; otherwise, that would be another route. My main goal is to not make it a big thing that she doesn't have a ton of friends, and trust that at some point she will click more with a small group.

    Nov 3, 2018

    I can totally relate. Our DD lost her best friend in a terrible accident when they were 10 and since then I know she's longed for that kind of close relationship (as I did when I was her age) and I also feel it all very deeply for her. That said, it will be ok. She has some friends, one closer friend but still not quite that bestie thing yet, but I have no doubt as she navigates through life she will. Keep the communication open, sometimes we do overthink/overfeel for them and it's more about us, and sometimes not. It's also helpful to be involved in lots of activities (music, dance, scouts, etc). There are a couple of girl based groups in Berkeley that might be of interest to you (they regularly advertise on BPN). Mine is heading to high school and doing great, so just give it time!

    Nov 7, 2018

    You are sensitive to what you think she is experiencing and you suspect she’s lonely. What has your daughter said to you? Has she been able to express what she is feeling and what she wants in friendships? If her best friend moves away, she’s “lost” her best friend. Maybe she’s wary of that. She may have a “friend needs” that are significantly different from yours. One thing you might try is to help provide additional arenas in which to cultivate friends. I found swim team to be wonderful because everyone swam together and cheered one another on and it was coed as well, so there was the opportunity to spend time with a diverse group of kids. Making friends outside of school is great as it expands the pool and lets children realize that school isn’t the only place for making new friends.  You might also suggest a planned outing with you—to the beach, Golden Gate Park, or to a movie and suggest she invite a friend. Sometimes that “specialness” helps spark a friendship. 

    Nov 7, 2018

    Post on nextdoor to find neighborhood friends. And she should join some kind of clubs and organizations to meet kids, too. School friendships are not enough. 

    Nov 7, 2018

    Hi there - I know the stress you're feeling on behalf of your daughter is real, but (as many folks have asked on other topics), is this your daughter's issue or yours?  Is she as stressed out or sad about the friend situation as you are?  My daughter (now 11, in 6th grade) went through elementary school never having a "best" friend.  She was just friends with several kids, but she often hung out by herself at recess, while other times she joined games or small groups of girls.  It really varied, and we checked in with her teachers at parent-teacher conferences regularly and all said "she's fine - she's just an independent kid."  My daughter never seemed at all concerned about not having a "bestie."  I worried that all the cliques would form and she'd be left out, but that never happened - things tend to be kind of fluid as they get older and girls who were inseparable in 3rd grade hardly hang out 3 years later.  Anyway, fast forward to now, she has a TON of friends in middle school, she's in several different groups of girls from her own elementary school and others, and seems to be the bridge between those groups.  She's very well-liked but still doesn't prefer to have one best friend.  This is not who I was as a kid, and probably not you either, but hopefully like my kid, yours is fine with the situation.  And if she's not, then like I said, things can be very fluid as they get older and there will be a lot of shifting and rearranging of loyalties.  Good luck!

    Nov 7, 2018

    Hello there - I went through this with my only-child daughter in 3rd grade (she is now in middle school) and my advice to you is this - 3rd grade is a transitional time for friendships and, though it feels very painful, it is a normal process for kids who have been friends to separate and find new friends.  It's really hard for your child to go through this, but the good news is that she WILL find other friends. The hard news as a parent is that she is now at an age where she has to navigate this herself and you can't force friendships.  I would agree that you are overthinking it and it sounds like you are letting your own anxiety get the better of you. The best thing you can do is to support your daughter and provide your understanding - don't let your anxiety cloud her own feelings about having friends. Frankly, it's normal to go through periods where one experiences loneliness, and she should not be made to feel bad about it, plus she needs to figure out her own ways of finding friends - it's part of growing up.

    Some positive suggestions from my own experience: (1) talk to the teacher about your concerns and ask what they have observed about the class dynamics. We did this, and found that the teacher was extremely aware of the social dynamics, and actually paired our daughter with another child on class projects who seemed to share her interests and it turned out that they became good friends. (2) Rather than playdates, find other ways for your child to connect with kids outside the classroom. For our daughter, Girl Scouts has been great for this, but any other activity where she can make friends with kids outside of school based on a common interest.

    Finally, as a parent of an only child, just to provide you reassurance that your child will work through this and that you should step back and not be so anxious about it.  These things go in cycles, and this is just the first of many waves of friendship vs. loneliness that she will encounter and sort out (just like you did, I am guessing). It will all work out!

    Nov 8, 2018

  • How do I help my shy 2nd grader make new friends?

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    Jun 3, 2018

    Some kids are lucky to be naturally outgoing.  I have a boy who is more shy and reserved, and has a more difficult time making friends in class.  Once he is completely comfortable with them, he is outgoing, fun, and very entertaining with his goofy sense of humor.

    Watching him from the outside, there are all these cliques of friends already formed for 2nd grade.  He has his own group of friends, but the dynamics are not very healthy (3 boys, always 1 is excluded), so I am encouraging him to find another group.

    How is this best/most efficiently achieved?  Through playdates?  We have done a bunch of those and are not excited to do a lot more because we do not have a lot in common with the other private school parents, and make mostly small talk.  Or afterschool classes?  Or should I sign him up for one of those social playgroups in SF that "teaches you how to platy"

    TIA

    Jun 3, 2018

    I’m sorry but you absolutely have to host more play dates, stop judging the other parents, get to know them in depth, quit making small talk, and MODEL building friendships with a diverse group of people. This is the only way, and you need to work at it for the next 12 years. Sending him to an after school program or camp will not work and will certainly not work with the peer group he’s spending time with for the next few years, his classmates. Volunteer to help with school related projects - get involved and get to genuinely know people. He is modeling your own anxious, low self esteem, judgy behavior right now, and it will hurt him all his life. Invite the nicest family to dinner and make it a special evening. Then do it for the second nicest, and so on. Give your son (and yourself) the gift of being truly friends with a broad spectrum of folks - what an amazing gift for all of you.

    Jun 6, 2018

    Playdates are really the best.  At this age, you can do drop-off playdates so you don't have to deal with the parents.  I have a first grader and usually drop off at someone's house or have a kid dropped off in mine.  Figure out which kids have personality that will match well with your son and arrange playdates for the kids.  I found out that I cannot control who my kids play with in school but can encourage closer friendships with the kids I like by doing frequent playdates with them.  I found that if I invite a kid for drop off playdate and offer to host the answer is almost always yes since the other parents are getting kid-free time or one less kid to worry about the an afternoon, etc and my son loves to have playmates his own age (he has younger siblings but loves playing with kids his age or older).   I usually monitor the playdate but don't get involved to see which boys are good influence on my boy and they are a good fit and invite those over more often.  After school activities rarely help unless they are large groups or you do activities afterwards in smaller groups since the focus is on the class activities and the groups at this age are large enough that no friendships are formed during the class. 

    Jun 6, 2018

    You might consider reaching out to his teacher and ask their help to make a good friend match. Also, try new activities and he might meet like minded friends there. Good luck!

    Jun 6, 2018

    While playdates seem ideal, they may not be with this cohort of kids.  If you have nothing in common with the parents, why would your son feel comfortable with their kids? You could try extracurricular interests...sports, arts, etc. and see if your son finds his way through a common interest. 

    Good Luck!

    Jun 6, 2018

    I have a first grade boy. I have observed that girls make friends by having good social skills while boys make friends by sharing common interests. This is of course a generalization but it might help your boy find some friends. See what he is interested in that other second grade boys are also interested in. Cultivate those interests. For example I gave my first grader a pack of Pokémon cards and next thing you know he is running with a pack of other Pokémon card collectors that he never played with before. If your son likes sports enroll him in team sports (individual sports like golf are not as useful in this scenario). Good luck! 

    Jun 6, 2018

    I have a more reserved son as well. I find it fascinating that our culture says being shy at age 7 is now an "issue" and poor well meaning parents (guilty myself at times) are made to believe we need to fix the problem. Honestly IMHO, I find that the vast majority of kids are just basically not very nice, because they are not taught to be so -this culture sees kindness as a weakness. I have always encouraged my kids to play with the kids they see by themselves/alone, to include them. Increasingly, excluding is what moves you up the social ladder. I would encourage your son to take up a game or activity at recess that is important and fun to him, and if others would like to join, great, and if not that's ok too.  Maybe you could talk to him about talking to his current group about it not being kind to exclude? We should train our children to be leaders, not followers. If you'd like him to have more positive contact then maybe scouting or sports or an outside activity where he can connect with kids who share his interest will help. It's not critical that he's best friends with his classmates, when he's in college he's not going to remember who he played with in 2nd grade but I'll bet you anything he'll remember the summer days you spent doing something amazing with him or the fun vacation your family had - He's only in 2nd grade, as long as he knows his family loves him he will be fine and as he grows more into himself he will become more comfortable - you are doing great!!

    Jun 7, 2018

    Keep hosting playdates with kids your son likes. At this age you can tell other parents they can drop off and pick up their kids. I think social development is crucial and kids need unstructured time to relate to their peers so I made it a priority to host even if it was not reciprocated or I didn't love the other parents. My daughter is a teen and she has a great friend since kindergarten and it is 80-20 we host the girls. She had another friend all through elementary school and we didn't really mesh with the parents but the kids friendship was important to them so we found ways to get along. It may not be a very efficient way to socialize your child but it's worth doing. As a teacher, I've met students who don't have playdates or get unstructured social time and they strike me as lonely. I wonder how they will relate to people when they are adults? Anyway provide those opportunities without pressuring yourself to do perfectly. 

    Jun 9, 2018

  • How should we navigate this friendship kindly, but not be suffocated?

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    May 27, 2018

    I am wondering whether I am worried about nothing. I have a 7yo son, "Adam" that became very good friends with another boy named "Leo" in kindergarten. Towards the end of the year, I became uncomfortable with their friendship they became too co-dependent--instead of playing with a group of boys as he previously did, my son now only played exclusively with Leo, just the 2 of them. We used to carpool with Leo, and when we couldn't, Leo had stomach aches and cried. When their playdates ended, the boys cried, even though they see each other at school every day.

    I stopped the carpools and requested that the boys be separated in 1st grade. My son now has made new friends and is able to play with different groups of boys at recess. Leo is in the other class, and now plays exclusively with another boy, "Eddie", just the 2 of them, even though my son routinely invites them to play with the group.  They now cry when their playdates end. When Eddie is sick and not at school, my son pulls away from his other friends to play with Leo "because he doesn't have anyone else."  When Eddie does join in play with the other boys, Leo would ask him throughout recess, "Are you still my friend?"

    Of course, Eddie's parents have requested that their son separated from Leo in 2nd grade. The teachers will put Adam and Leo will be back in the same class again next year because Leo needs more emotional support. How do I teach my son kindness, to play with and include everyone, but also not be sucked into such an intense friendship with Leo and be isolated from the rest of the class again? I had sleepless nights last year when we cut off carpools/playdates with Leo's family, because I worried that I would hurt Leo. But I also do not want my son to be the social emotional solution for Leo for the next 8 years. Please help me do the right thing for both kids. 

    I hope that Leo will grow out of this, but it might not be soon.  He is the one that cries when it is too loud at lunch, when the boys are too boisterous in PE.  When I comment to his parents that the boys need to branch out more, they even more playdates with Adam, because "they do not want to break up the friendship".

    May 27, 2018

    I'm likely not a nice person, but I would request that my son not be in the same class as Leo.  A second grader is not mature enough to handle the pressure of another kid who is constantly depended on him for entertainment and uses emotional manipulation (which I view to include asking if he is still his friend the moment he plays with other boys, even if unintentional).  If Leo needs more emotion support than the teachers can provide it or the kids can play together in recess, but it should not be the job of a second grader to serve that role.  If your son does end up in the same class as Leo, I would make sure that you son is not isolated from other friends either by asking for teacher's help in that (your son gets at least 1-2 recess a week where he plays with other friends) or at least by scheduling regular playdates with other kids in his class.  Leo needs support and is beyond nice of you to allow your son to serve in that role, but as a second grader he is still a kid and in my view it is your job as a mother to make sure that serving in that role does not come at a cost of his own emotional well being and friendships with other kids.  

    P.S. I likely feel stronger about this than most since I was in a similar position to Adam and Eddie in elementary with a friend who attached herself to me (like Leo in your question), and I'm beyond grateful to my parents for extracting me from that situation (they moved me to another class/recess period mid-year) and allowing me the freedom to play with many other kids and not have another child following me around and crying every time I wanted to play with someone else or do something else and making me feel guilty and like a "bad-friend" for even expressing an interest to play with other kids.  At the time I thought it was fine and that she just really liked playing with me but looking back as an adult I see that relationship was not healthy and my emotional and social well being in school improved drastically after I was separated from that friend. 

    May 29, 2018

    I feel for you and for all of the kids involved. As a child, I often asked my best friend in elementary school if we were still best friends at random times, usually when I was feeling particularly insecure. I was a worrier and my insecurities got the best of me at times. I agree it wasn't my best friend's responsibility to provide me with emotional support and stability, and she often told me that she wouldn't be my best friend if I kept asking. That was usually enough to keep me at bay for a while. Eventually, I did grow out of this and she and I were very good friends until she was held back and we were no longer in the same grade. I say all of this, not to suggest that you just wait it out, but to share that I can relate somewhat. Has your son ever let "Leo" know that he doesn't want to play with him when he acts certain ways? That seemed to work in my case though the message needed to be delivered more than once. Perhaps there are things going on at home for "Leo" that are influencing his singular attachments? Lot's of possibilities, but at the end of the day, I totally agree that your son deserves an environment that is freeing and joyful. Hopefully the summer break will help. Lots can change in a few months. 

    May 30, 2018

    Your post resonated with me. I can empathize as you try to deal with this difficult situation in a compassionate way. Parenting is hard. 

    My kid (call them G) had (has?) a friend relationship like that. They met in middle school, so they were a bit older than the "Leo/Adam" dyad, but the dynamics were very similar. G's friend (call them H) just had a lot of emotional immaturity. H wanted to hang out with G all the time, and got jealous when G spent time with anyone else. It was hard for G to learn how to navigate boundaries with H, and we had a lot of talks about G's responsibility to their on personal space, as well as being kind to H. At the time, G was seeing a counselor (for other issues) who helped G sort through their feelings. After they entered high school, H felt abandoned by G as they developed new relationships, and there were hard feelings. Right now they seem to have worked it out, although they have mostly drifted apart. 

    I think it's common for kids to attach themselves to people who will enable them. In my kid's case, this has come up a few times but not so extreme as it was in middle school. My kid ended up playing the role of "counselor/therapist" for their friends and it compounded the problem. It was very helpful for my kid to have someone else to talk to about what was going on, and to recognize patterns in their own behavior so they can make good decisions about their relationships.  Group therapy, or social skills classes, would benefit your kid as well "Leo," for different reasons. These are great lessons to learn about co-dependency, interdependency, setting boundaries, and compassion and kindness. Since the kids in your case are young, obviously these terms are a little out of their developmental understanding, but they can certainly start to work on the same concepts. If you have a trusted and knowledgeable teacher or administrator you can ask for advice, please do so. I'm sure they've seen this sort of stuff a lot. Best of luck!

    May 30, 2018

    I agree with the other reply. I absolutely would ensure that my kid wouldn’t be in the same class as the emotional vampire child. Sorry but your kids needs come 1st.

    - Jamie 

    May 30, 2018

    I would discuss this with my pediatrician or family therapist and ask for a written letter with their recommendation for your son's class placement.  This is too much pressure for a young child to deal with these intense needs.  Your son can be a supportive friend to Leo on the playground, but having to be in the same class given the past dynamic with him sounds inappropriate and unfair.  A letter from a professional will be considered seriously.  If you are unsatisfied with the placement decision, you might ask for a Student Study Team meeting (in writing) to discuss your concerns.

    May 30, 2018

  • Boy with overprotective mom

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    Dec 7, 2017

    My son has a boy in his class with a very protective mom.  Basically every time the boy has a conflict with another kid or gets hurt (even if just accidentally during playtime) she insists that her boy is a victim and the other kid is hurting her kid (the word bullying is thrown around a lot too!!!) and that the other kid needs to be separated from her son and not play with him.  The teachers are going along with it.  My son told me this week that this boy has nobody to play with during recess -- at this point the list of kids who are not allowed to play with him is over half of the class and includes most of the boys (I believe all except for 4 boys).  My son was added to the list a few months ago because the other boy fell and skinned his knee during a game of chase and tag at recess when my son was chasing him. I remember the teacher telling me about it and said my kid is not punished but he cannot play with the other boy because of his mom's wishes. I really feel bad for that boy.  My son is saying that he is not allowed to play with any of his prior friends and is constantly told to go play with the girls or some of the boys not on the list but he likes active play and the kids not on his no-play list usually don't engage in it.  I know this is not my problem and my son has plenty of friends to play with, but is there something I can do except just making sure the teacher is aware of it -- though I cannot see how she can not see this is going on.  I told my son that I know he feels bad for the boy and I do too but I don't want him to get in trouble and so until the teacher says otherwise he is not allowed to play with this kid since I don't want him to get punished if the boy gets hurt accidentally during play with him or if the teacher sees and decided to say something.  Any advice?  This situation is beyond ridiculous and I cannot believe the school let it get this bad.   

    Dec 7, 2017

    You are very kind for wanting to fix this. I would too. Maybe someone could suggest that the mom observe what's going on at school for a while and see how her son is being impacted? I doubt that talking to her will help much but maybe if she was watching (without her son knowing that she's watching) she'll see that her policies are harming her son. It would also help for her to see how the kids interact with each other on the playground and the lack of overt bullying.

    What a sad story. Maybe she reads this newsletter and will recognize the problems that she's causing for her son. Kids get hurt all the time. It's really not a big deal.

    Dec 13, 2017

  • 8 yr old boy sad about not having friends

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    Jan 19, 2017

    My son is an only child and is sensitive.  He is very caring and funny but he has trouble making friends.  And since he is sensitive, kids tend to tease him and his feelings get hurt pretty easily which probably makes the situation worse.  He did have a best friend but they are growing apart.  His friend is noticing girls and my son is still just interested in playing.....this is also causing him heartache as he feels his friend doesn't like him anymore.

    He has told me that he feels useless and that no one likes him and that his life is hard and he doesn't want to be alive.  I do not know what to tell him or how to help him.  

    What have others done to help their kids?

    Advice is greatly appreciated---it just break my heart that he doesn't have a good friend and is so sad about this.

    Jan 19, 2017

    Maybe try some activities outside of school, such as dance, ice skating, soccer, baseball, swimming, to try to make different groups of friends. Also, perhaps he could accept that friends have other friends, too? Like tree branches or something, just because he is exclusively friends with someone doesn't mean they are exclusive with him, however are still friends.

    Jan 23, 2017

    Hi,
    My son just turn to toddler.. but I am sad about what you mention and is sound like how I grow up (feel like everyone don’t like me, not the popular girl type)…
    Try to bring him to church! This helps a lot…
    even my son is just 20 months, I can tell he is different than kids don’t go to church, not shy, care on small thing (when he see trash on the floor he will pick him up and throw away), and he is willing to play with other kids too, laugh a lot for many small thing

    Jan 25, 2017

    My oldest is 13 and has always had social problems. There are social skills classes and camps (probably lots of recommendations here on this board) which can help him with his confidence. But basically you have to find him groups outside of school. Sports, theatre, art, doesn't matter what it is but anything to get him around kids his own age. 

    Jan 25, 2017

    Would you consider having him join the Boy Scouts? I know the national organization's politics are illiberal, but East Bay scout packs and troops have always welcomed all boys, no matter who they are or what their families look like. Scouting is a wonderful way for boys to meet their peers, be part of a group, learn skills, and have fun. My son is a scout in a Berkeley troop, it's a really great experience. Your son would start in the Cub Scouts - he might love it! You're welcome to contact me if you want more info.  

    Jan 25, 2017

    I'm so sad to hear about your son. I know it's tough. My son is 7.5 and we experienced the same thing when we moved here from southern California. We are a military family and had to adjust to the "real" world. My son was spoiled with a small family of friends who were our neighbors. To help him meet friends, I signed him up for soccer. I would "put myself out there" so I could mode friend making. It was hard because I'm shy and really had to push myself. Anytime we went to the park, we would bring lots of toys that would involve more than one player. Soon other kids would join in the fun and want to play. I would play until they were engaged. Hope that helps. We could have a playdate if you're interested.

    Jan 25, 2017

    Hi there! 

    I totally feel for you! I have a 7 year old son who is an only child as well, and has some of the same traits, i.e. being sensitive, feelings hurt easily, etc. He also does not have a ton of really good friends and can have a bit of a temper.  One thing that I started doing over the summer was organizing more one on one playdates for him, as I feel like he was not getting enough peer to peer time. Trust me, it is a lot of work, and sometimes awkward, but I think it is helping. I find out boys who he would like to play with or get to know better and then arrange for playdates either after school or on the weekends. Usually a few hours at a time is plenty to start off with.  Also, I try to volunteer at the school so I can get see how he is interacting with other kids and also find out what other boys he seems to like or he might get along with. I work so I can't do this often, but it is enlightening when I can get there. Also, last year I approached his teacher and told her my concerns and she actually suggested setting up playdates with a few boys in the class that she felt were nice and that he would have fun with. Have you spoken to his teacher?  I agree it's also good to get him involved in activities outside of school.  In general, I think it's harder for only kids to make friends initially when they are younger, just based on the other only kids I see around the neighborhood/school.  However, all of my friends who were onlies seem very happy and have tons of friends! I think it just takes time.  

    Please try not to be sad and realize there are things you can do - take action and it will make you feel better. When I talked to my son's teacher last year I was in the same place as you and actually broke down in tears with her. She was so sweet and encouraging.  I was losing sleep worried about him and felt better once I started making a plan.  I hope you can get some support and hopefully others share what has worked for them or provide helpful suggestions.

    Good luck! 

    Jan 25, 2017

    It is difficult to watch our kids suffer socially, but learning to choose friends is a part of growing up.  Sure you can set up social situations for him, you can get him into a social skills group, but it's ultimately going to be up to him.  Some kids are just slow to mature, others are destined to spend more time alone.  I have an only child and have gone through the process (my kid is now almost 17) as well.  My kid decided by 5th grade that many of the kids in school weren't worth the effort.  Now, my kid has friends who are usually more mature than other classmates.  Some kids prefer their own company (especially only children) or the company of other only children.  Sensitive kids have their reasons for reacting the way they do.  My kid has a learning difference and a strong sense of social justice.  I'm finally at the place where I can see college in the near future and I can understand more clearly the young adult my kid is becoming.  Be kind, supportive, and loving -- the rest will work itself out.

    Jan 25, 2017

    You may have already tried this, but if not, I think it's worth talking to his teachers about his feelings and experiences. They may be able to help, but they may also give you some insight into how he is during the day at school. We had similar experiences with my kid - it's very difficult to watch as a parent. One thing I learned was that all I heard from my child was the negative stuff, but the reality was that during the day, he was actually quite happy and social most of the time. Granted he had no "best friend", but his day wasn't nearly as terrible as I had imagined based on his reports. Another thing we learned over time is that different schools have very different social environments, and kids' perspectives of their peers can get locked in at a very early age. When we finally changed to a new school (for middle school), my kid's social experience has been radically different (and much better). Not every place is right for every kid. See how it goes, and perhaps your son's situation will improve. If not, perhaps you might consider a different school more suited to your child, or at least one where he can start fresh and reinvent himself amongst children who don't have preconceived ideas about who he is. 

    Jan 25, 2017

    If your son said he doesn't want to be alive, that calls for attention.  You should seek a good therapist.  Schools have therapists too.  Getting your child involved in group sports like soccer, baseball, swimming, etc., provides a group activity which will make him feel included.  Doesn't have to make friends with everyone, but it will teach him social skills.  Start him now, don't wait until he is 13.  Good luck and always listen to your gut.

    Jan 25, 2017

    Hello, I definitely empathize with what you are going though.  Just a few weeks ago, I posted a similar note about my 9 year old son, who is also very sad about not having any friends.  It, too, breaks my heart.  I have two kids; the oldest, 12, has a group of friends he is close with and they are very social in and outside of school.  My youngest has never had those kind of friendships and he is lonely.  He is a fun kid who, too, is sensitive.  He loves video games and animals and likes riding on his scooter.  He is a social kid and I dont understand why friendships are not forged.  When I wrote my post, I was looking for playgroups but it doesn't seem like there are any for their age group (that aren't sports, for example).  I was also looking for parents that might have kids his age to try to connect with.  Although I didn't get any replies, I did find your ad.  Might you and your son be interested in connecting some time with my son and I (and my girlfriend) in the Bay Area, maybe at a park some weekend?  Perhaps they would enjoy one another's company.  If interested, please send me a note.  And, if not, I wish you luck and hope we can continue a dialogue to share resources/ideas.  I just want my son to be happy and enjoy life with some quality friends.  

    Jan 25, 2017

    I am really sad to hear about your sad son. Elain Aron writes about the Highly Sensitive Child and has books for adults too.  And she has a great website that might shed light and provide additonal resources for you. Hsperson.com.  Definitely helped me understand the matter better, esp for little boys and myself.  Tedd Zeff also writes a bit about the Highly sensitive boy. My son is 7 yrs old and sounds similar, though not sad.  The Meher School in Lafayette is amazing in being a nurturing environment for sensitive personality types.  I could see your son "fitting" in and thriving there, if it is an option for you. It is an affordable private school filled with many sensitive boys and girls.   Please let him know he is not alone and it's just a matter of time before he finds the "right" crowd that can appreciate who he is (this is where you can elaborate on his wonderful traits of empathy and caring for others, his kindness, etc. things that are so unique and precious, just have to figure the puzzle to making it work for us).  Good luck, and all the best!

    Jan 25, 2017

    I suspect you will get a lot of suggestions of finding friends in other arenas. Kids need to find “their people” folks who share the same interests. I would really search for groups he might like more - after school chess club, a chorus. lego club, martial arts classes, along with all the other types of traditional sports. Look for a community that he can feel a part of. You could also invite kids from his class to do really fun things - Berkeley Adventure Playground, Iceskating, the Exploratorium. Things that would smooth over difficult starts and make being around your child super fun. I would urge you to become friendly with other parents too, kids his age don’t arrange playdates, their parents do. At the same time I would ask your son’s teacher how he is doing at school socially. The teacher might give you some insight into how your son presents himself at school and might have some suggestions for how to expand his social circle. Volunteer at school or to go on field trips so you can see for yourself how he is at school. I am very concerned with how depressed your son is. I think he would benefit from working with a child therapist. A social skills group might help. I think your son is very clearly letting you know he needs help and I would not ignore it. He is still young enough that an intervention now could be very effective and easier than you’d expect. Search BPN network for therapist recommendations. Best wishes to you and your family.

    Jan 26, 2017

    I had a similar situation. So heartbreaking to see your child struggle. I am alarmed at what he has told you. I know it is expensive but urge you to get him evaluated with an experienced child psychologist (only choose one who is referred to you -this list is a great way to get referrals) Once my child was properly diagnosed I was able to begin learning how to help her -it is a long expensive road -(I will be digging out financially for a while )  but things can get better. They definitely did for us though it took much education and work. Best of luck 

    Jan 26, 2017

    We went through exactly what you are describing with my son, who is now 10.  We tried many things that didn't really work.  We changed schools.  We finally found a great fit for him in the DaVinci School for gifted children.  All the kids who are there are like him too, and it's a beautiful and supportive place.  Plus the academics are fabulous.  I don't know if that fits your son, but if it does then this school is a great place to be.   Wishing you the best.

    Jan 26, 2017

    Your post breaks my heart. I really feel for your son--and you! As an adult who is prone to depression, and the mom of an awesome but extremely sensitive (in both the best and worst ways) 6 year old, I can completely relate and will be reading with interest the responses you get. Unfortunately I have more questions and concerns than answers at this point since I haven't gotten very far in the journey with my daughter yet, but one book that has been on my reading list for a long time, which you might also want to consider, is The Optimistic Child by Seligman. Hopefully you can find some good strategies in there for helping your son build resilience. Another idea is to just make sure your son has ample opportunities to pursue his natural interests. My parents always picked my extracurriculars (swim team) and they weren't usually aligned with my interests (art), so I struggled to meet other kids that I clicked with. You are probably already doing that, but just in case! Best of luck to you.

    Jan 27, 2017

    There is a wonderful little book (below) - which is very much oriented towards problem solving, where you and your son can work together on helping him acquire social skills he needs. I used this with my son, and in the span of a few weeks, it gave him confidence to understand the problem (why he gets teased) and deal with it himself. It will require a little bit of engagement on your part, but I liked precisely that. 

    Book: "Raise Your Child's Social IQ"https://www.amazon.com/Raise-Your-Childs-Social-IQ/dp/0966036689/

    Feb 1, 2017

    A second the recommendation of a school change. Once social patterns are "set" they can be very hard to break.

    Our eccentric but very bright son did much better socially in a school for quirky, gifted kids. Nobody was "normal," so cliques didn't really form, and his brains and creativity were much better appreciated by his peers. (This school was, unfortunately for you, in Southern California, but there are similar establishments in the Bay Area.)

    I am not of the school that kids should learn to lump it with the school hand they're dealt. Any more than adults should learn to lump it with a job that's a bad fit! As a kid who's Dad's employment generated many moves and new schools, I found that I was popular in some schools, marginal in others. No one fits in everywhere.

    If it is a financial possibility for you, I hope you check out some other schools for him. When you see the right one, you'll get a warm glow in your stomach -- you'll just know.

    Feb 1, 2017

    Hi,

    Your description of your son sounds like what mine was going through last winter/spring in 2nd grade.  He's very sensitive and his "best friend" would manipulate him and his feelings because it made him feel powerful.  When my son would react by either crying or getting angry (usually both), he would push other friends away.  He became very gloomy, concerning us, his teachers, the principal, and his pediatrician. We found a psychologist for him, told him he was going to a "feelings doctor", and explained that this was a person who was working for him--not his parents, teachers, friends, etc.--but him.  And we told him he could talk about whatever he wanted to discuss or even nothing at all.  I don't know whether it was the therapist or something else, but he immediately began to get better.  He's still sensitive, and his family history makes it more likely that he'll have a mood disorder, so he continues to see her on a weekly basis.  Things aren't perfect, but I'm no longer terrified that my son is clinically depressed.  If you'd like to talk to me about any of this, please ask the moderator for my contact info.  Good luck! It's so hard to see your son suffer.

    Feb 1, 2017

  • First grade son having trouble at recess

    –
    Oct 18, 2016

    My first grade son has been having challlenges at recess.  He says all his friends just want to play ball sports (four square, wall ball and the like) and they are telling him he's not very good. And he is somewhat uncoordinated for this age. We are trying to help him develop some new strategies (find a new friend who wants to play the games you are interested in, etc) but he's resistant, and sad. Ideas?

    Oct 18, 2016

    Does your school have Playworks coaches? Playworks is a nonprofit in Oakland that provides playground coaches to teach the kids good social skills along with a wide variety of games for every level. In my opinion, it is a better anti-bullying program than any of the dedicated anti-bullying programs I have seen. I recommend them highly - they can help your kid get better at stuff and encourage other kids to be kinder. It's hard to direct this stuff from home. 

    Oct 19, 2016

    Go after school or over the weekend and practice the games with your son so he can develop skills needed to enjoy recess with the friends he is spending the most time with. Bring a few friends (his/yours) to help you with practice to provide a neutral balance so it'll be more fun (not just a parent thing, but a group experience, I think will boost his confidence overall).

    Oct 19, 2016

    Could you get onto the school grounds on the weekends and practice those games with him?  It might be less stressful to learn how to do the games in a parent-led setting, than to try to find kids to make friends with who don't play the games.  Playground games are relatively easy to master IF the child can play them frequently.  Also, in a 1st - 3rd grade recess, you could suggest that the yard duty teacher make one court a 1st & 2nd grade court and another court the 3rd grade court.  

    Oct 19, 2016

    My daughter was like this for a while- we actually ended up going to an Occupational Therapist initially for ADHD but as an amazing side effect, all her coordination and active/sports based skills improved tremendously.  She was the girl that in 1st grade feigned a hurt leg just so she wouldn't have to be seen stumbling in Soccer Shots- and now she actively seeks out sports she is interested in and has her confidence back!  She was tested initially and was found positive for vertigo, which is a vestibular funtion issue- its actually really common to have this issue and it affects body awareness.

    Oct 19, 2016

    See if the teacher can set him up with a friend from class. The teacher may have a sense of what connection will "click."

    School can be tough. Having even one friend who "gets you" makes a huge difference.

    Another option to consider is getting him into an activity outside of school based on his interests. Then he will build a foundation of friendship and gain some confidence, too.

    Oct 19, 2016

    You've gotten some great suggestions, but I would also suggest that you meet with the teacher, principal, yard duties, whoever, and get that nastiness shut down. It is NOT healthy (or normal, imho, based on 16 years teaching 2nd and 3rd grades) for first graders to be that competitive and mean. I know that if I heard that kind of talk on my watch, I would immediately get some 4th or 5th graders to play those kids so they can see what it feels like to be "not good." And then, of course, we would have a healthy conversation. No matter how much you practice games with your son, there will always be somebody better and those mean kids will still be mean-if not to him than to somebody else. I do hope he gets tired of it too, and finds some like-minded, nicer kids.

    Oct 19, 2016

    How uncoordinated is your child?  Although I had friends as a child, I suffered at school recesses because do to my motor difficulties, I was unable to take part in many of the activities and definitely impacted my self-esteem.  You might want to ask your pediatrician if your son's gross and fine motor skill development is age appropriate and whether you should request a Student Study Team meeting at his school to discuss ways of helping your son's motor development and his social integration at school.

    Oct 19, 2016

    My son is/was similar - interested in the playground games but not much ability compared to peers. Obviously the peers notice, and to me it is overreacting to call it bullying when peers comments on differences in ability. We did buy some playground balls and practice the games with him on the weekend, so I'd second that recommendation. What helped the most honestly was moving up a grade and sharing the playground with younger kids who were more at his ability level. And BTW we are a Playworks school too, but there's only one coach spread out at recess, s/he is not going to have time to help one little kid every day with 4-square!

    Oct 20, 2016

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